I think that the unexpected fall of Slaviansk hit us all very hard. We were used to think of it as a new Stalingrad, as a Donbass version of Bint Jbeil, and the sudden withdrawal of Strelkov’s forces was a surprise for us all. And I really mean us all, including the Ukies (who had predicted that Strelkov would fight to the last bullet there). And that is exactly what Strelkov wanted.
I could go over all the arguments of Auslander or those of the anonymous Ukie General, but all I could add is that I agree with them. But why do that again? I already discussed the likely evolution of the combat situation in the Donbass (see here) and I specifically discussed the only real importance of Slaviansk, a symbolic one. If somebody still sincerely believes that Strelkov’s move was anything short of a very smart and perfectly timed withdrawal from an untenable position, I have no more arguments to challenge such a belief. To the others I will say this: retreating is one of the most difficult and important skills in warfare, completely underestimated and misunderstood by civilians, it constitutes a grueling and most revealing test of the quality of the forces executing it. It appears that Strelkov achieved a near-perfect, orderly and impeccably timed retread from an already surrounded Slaviansk and that is the best proof possible of his superb tactical skills.
What I would like to do now, is look not at the tactical issues, but at Russian strategic options. Not how Russia would try to do this or that, but rather what the Russian final, campaign, objective is likely to be.
Putin’s motives and goals
First, I have to tell you that the only logical working hypothesis about Putin is that he is doing what he believes is the best for Russia and the Russian people. The notion that he is a “coward” or that he “sold out” is at prima facie ridiculous: if that had been the case, he would not have ordered the Russian forces to snatch the Crimean Peninsula right under the nose of the US and NATO. Nor would he have dared to openly challenge the AngloZionists over Syria. No, if Putin is not sending the Russian forces into the Donbass it has nothing to do with fear or with a some putative Russian weakness. It has everything to do with the fact that he has come to the conclusion that this would not be the right tactic to achieve his strategic goal. That is the only logical explanation.
I would note that a recent poll also shows that 60% (sixty percent!) of Russians agree with him and do not want to send troops into the Donbass. Does that mean that 60% of Russians are cowards or have been bought off by the NWO? Hardly.
Sending in Russian forces into Novorussia is a tactic, a means to achieve something else. This is not a goal per se, right? So what is the goal?
I think that the first thing we need to ask is this: can Russia accept, or somehow live with, the US project? What is that project again? A unitary (non-federal) Ukraine run by russophobic Nazis completely under US control, with NATO inside the Ukraine and any forms of Russian influence out. At the very best, that would mean that Crimea would be under constant threat of attack and, at the worst, this would mean a Ukie/NATO/US attack on Crimea as soon as enough forces would have been mustered. Ask yourself, is that an outcome acceptable for Russia? Is there any chance that Putin could be persuaded to accept this? My reply is an emphatic ‘no way!’. This is simply not an outcome Russia can accept, regardless of who sits in the Kremlin.
Ok, so what about a deal with Poroshenko? Something like, “you give up Crimea, and I give up Donbass“?
Nonsense. First, there is no Poroshenko. Well, ok, there is a guy called Poroshenko in Kiev, but he has no power at all. The real power is not even Obama, it’s the US “deep state”: Obama’s puppet masters and Poroshenko’s puppet masters. Now ask yourself a basic question: does the US “deep state” need Donbass? Of course not!
The Donbass – who needs it who does not?
What is the Donbass? In a few words, the Donbass is a completely Russian region which by the absurdities of history has found itself part of the Ukraine, just like Crimea. Furthermore, the Donbass is a region almost exclusively focused on trade with Russia. It has coal and high tech industrial capabilities (including military). The US, the EU or even the AngloZionist empire as a whole has exactly zero need for the Donbass. Russia yes, Russia could definitely use much of the potential of the Donbass, but not anybody else. Now, if the Donbass is handed over the the Nazi-controlled rump-Ukraine (what I call Banderastan) it will thereby and automatically lose any and all of its value: cut off from Russia, the Donbass is useless. Just like a key is only useful when there is a lock, Donbass is only useful through its relationship to Russia. Cut that off and Donbass is worthless.
So what would happen to a Donbass part of a unitary Banderastan? Well, first, Russia would have to immediately cut it off from the Common Trade Zone (to protect Russia, Belarus, Kazakhstan, Armenia and future members) from EU goods. Furthermore, the junta freaks have already announced that Banderastan will not supply the Russian military industry. Besides, the Donbass is already in free fall – since the beginning of the year the exports to Russia have dropped, if I am not mistaken here, by something like 1/4, or 25%. So, let’s face it, if the Nazi junta ever gets the Donbass, it will be a wasteland, and not the major source of income it has been since 1991.
Setting aside the “patriotic” values of an imaginary state (the Ukraine) “re-taking” its historical lands (at least in their imagination), the Donbass has zero value and therefore neither the junta nor the US will ever agree to such a trade.
You might ask why the Ukies are fighting so hard to get their hands on a useless piece of land. It is really simple.
So what is the fight really all about?
First, remember, the Ukies decide nothing. It’s Uncle Sam. And Uncle Sam wants a new Cold War, Uncle Sam fosters wars and crises everywhere, because that is crucial to justify NATO and because it keeps the dollar going. For Uncle Sam, a decade long war in the Donbass is perfect: make them accursed Russkies pay for Syria, get NATO closer to Russia’s border, scare the crap of out the Europeans, crash the Euro in the process, and justify NATO. What could be better?!
But the junta also has a need for war. For one thing, it provide the perfect scapegoat: Putin, the Moskals, the all-powerful FSB, etc. That also creates an atmosphere of fear, which is excellent for police powers, human and civil rights abuses, etc. It also allows the Nazis to hunt for “saboteurs” and “Russian agents” (anybody who disagrees with their ideology or policies). A war is also a perfect way to explain the crisis. It is even a way to make great money: Kolomoiski has already made millions by overcharging the Ukie military for fuel. Last but not least, wars create chaos and thugs always like chaos and lawlessness: that is an environment they always prosper in.
So both Uncle Sam and his Nazi junta in Kiev want war, not the Donbass.
What does that mean for Russia?
Well, we have established that Russia cannot allow the US plan for the Ukraine to succeed. Russia cannot allow a unitary Nazi and NATO state on its western border. We also have established that no deal can be made, there is nothing to negotiate simply because neither Uncle Sam nor the Nazi junta have any interest at all in any form of negotiations. The only possible conclusion from this is that Russia has only one option left: victory. Or, if you prefer, total defeat for the junta in Kiev and for Uncle Sam.
In reality, Russia has no choice
I want to stress here that this is not strictly speaking a “choice”. Think of it this way: if I point a gun at your chest and say ‘your money or your life’ you do, I suppose, have kind of a “choice”, but we don’t really call that a choice, do we? Same here, Russia does, of course, have the choice to put her very existence at risk, but no sane Russian ruler could ever agree to let a unitary Nazi Ukraine on the Russian border. So Russia has to resist this outcome. Russia must defeat this US/Nazi alliance and its goals. And for this the Nazi junta in Kiev must fall.
To put it simply: Russia’s real goal in the Ukraine is regime change.
Nothing short of that will do. Russia must absolutely de-Nazify at least most of the Ukraine, at the very least everything west of the Dniepr and probably even Kiev. If Russia had a common border with a normal, sane, Ukraine and that Ukraine had a common border with some kind of small Galician Banderastan, then Russia probably could live with it. But such a mini-Banderastan would be either highly subversive to the rest of the Ukraine or non-viable. I cannot imagine that. Besides, chances are that even the folks in the western Ukraine will come to their senses sooner or later and realize that Nazism is good for nobody, not even for them.
The Ukie freak show |
Right now, the Ukrainian people have clearly gone mad. The latest poll shows that pedophile maniac Liashko as the most popular political figure in Banderastan. Followed by Iulia Timoshenko and Vitalii Klichko. Looks terrible, of course, but look at those numbers again: all the candidates shown here together get 74%. So what about the remaining 26%? Whom would they pick?
When you have the most popular politician at 23.1% and the six most popular ones together at 74% – you know that you have a country in a deep political crisis. And also, we are not told why the polled Ukrainians picked these figures? Okay, to pick Liashko you have to be a raving lunatic or a drooling idiot or both. But what about the rest? Maybe they were picked not as the best, but as the “least worst”? Whatever may be the case, I suspect that most Ukrainians are decent, mentally sane, and basically good people. Sure, there is a large number of freaks amongst them, but that is normal in a country which is basically bankrupt and which has undergone 20 years of russophobic neo-Nazi brainwashing. This has got to change. Sooner or later, this has got to change.
If we add to this the fact that the Ukraine is basically finished economically, dead for all practical purposes, and that no matter what the economic crisis will explode before the end of the year, we can see why regime change might very well happen even without any Russian intervention at all.
The only game plan in town
From the above we can make a three simple and basic conclusions:
1) Under no circumstances can Russia allow Novorussia to fall
2) Regime change in Kiev is a vital Russian strategic goal
3) Moscow will only move in its military forces as a last resort
Now Putin’s game plane become, I think, clear: keep Novorussia capable of resisting while waiting for regime change in Kiev. This, of course, does not mean that Russia’s aid will become official, though it might, especially if the Ukies go crazy and the humanitarian situation get’s worse. Furthermore, and cynical as this may sound, the war in Novorussia is a fantastic factor of psychological mobilization of the people in Russia and in Novorussia. Again, let’s face it, what I call the “resistance potential” of Novorussia is far from being achieved and most Novorussians are still observing it all on TV. But now that Slaviansk has fallen and it looks that Donetsk and Lugansk are next and now that Ukie artillery can already been heard downtown, you can rest assured that more and more Novorussians are going to realize that this is not a war they can simply observe on their TV sets: they voted for independence en masse, now they will have to defend that choice, also en masse.
As for Russia, I can assure you that the daily barrage of horrible, outrageous and infuriating news from the Ukraine has already had a huge impact in Russia. Just consider these figures which a Kremlin official has released yesterday. Officially, there are now 481’268 refugees from the Ukraine in Russia, 414’726 in the border region (Rostov) alone, and 20’461 have already applied for refugee status. So while the US State Department denies the reality of this phenomenon or, alternatively, explains it by the fresh air of the “Rostov mountains” (no such thing) or by people “visiting their grannies”, the Russian audiences are shown huge Il-76 heavy transport aircraft regurgitating entire families, long lines of refugees on Russian border posts (which, by the way, the Ukies regularly strike “by mistake”), popular music groups (such as DDT) make concerts to collect assistance funds, entire tent cities build by (the world class) EMERCOM and scores of refugees are hosted all over Russia in hotels, families or even specially built centers. So please don’t kid yourself, if the horrors in the Donbass are “not seen” by the western Ziomedia, they are a daily feature on all Russian news media and this barrage of events is having a deep and long-term effect on the general population.
The good news for Novorussia and Russia
Banderastan is doomed. Right now, it is artificially kept alive by western aid, by Russian gas (illegally diverted into reserves this Spring) and, mostly, by inertia. Just like a big train cannot stop immediately, so a big state like the (now defunct) Ukraine cannot just crash overnight. But if is losing its momentum at a dizzying speed. Moscow has turned off the gas, foreign loans will barely cover the interests on the Ukie debt and the war in the East of the country is not only costing billions, but it is destroying the infrastructure of the richest part of the former Ukraine. The Kiev junta is composed of incompetent freaks who have no idea at all as to how to tackle the real problems and who, therefore, literally only execute Uncle Sams orders. As for Uncle Sam, not only does he not give a damn about the Ukies and their pathetic Banderastan – he is quite happy with having set-off such a huge crisis right between the EU and Russia.
What about the so-called “anti-terrorist operation” against Novorussia? Well, let’s just say that the new Minister of Defense of Banderastan has exactly zero military experience and that he has already announced that the Ukie strategy will be to encircle and blockade Lugansk and Donetsk. Yup, that’s right, the Ukies have already announced that they will not try to take these cities. Of course, since the junta has always lied about everything, we can be pretty darn sure that they will give it a shot, but since their chances of success are close to zero (offensive urban operations negate almost all Ukie advantages), they have already announced that this is not a goal.
[As a side bar, I would note here that something interesting happened: following the Ukie “victory” in Slaviank, a whole number of top-raking Ukie security officials have been fired and replaced. What does that tell you about the real meaning of what happened?]
There is no doubt that time is on Russia’s side and that the collapse of the entire Banderastani state is inevitable within the next 4-6 months. What really remains to be seen is whether Novorussia will be able to resist without overt Russian help for that long. My guess is that yes, it will, but with the Ukie takeover of the entire northwest part of Novorussia (the greater area around the Slavianks-Kramatorsk) the Novorussian have no more strategic depth. Now it’s “not a step back” time both for Novorussia and for Russia herself. Another Ukie success could turn the tide, especially psychologically. It is one thing to surrender an indefensible town, quite another to lose Gorlovka or Snezhnoe and risk losing the Krasnyi Luch – Antartsit node. If these key nodes get overrun by the Ukies the defense of Luganska and Donestk will become Novorussia’s last stand.
In conclusion – dispelling a few myths
There are a couple of myths I think need to be dispelled in conclusion. The first one is that resistance was futile, that Strelkov or Putin (or both) did the the Novorussians what Papa Bush did to the Iraqi Shia: told them to rise up only to let them be massacred. In fact, this idea assumes that Nazis can act without terror and massacres. So let me remind you here that there was no uprising, no Strelkov, in Odessa, which nonetheless got its massacre and which now lives in a daily regime of terror. Furthermore, the same regime of terror can now be found in Kharkov which, initially, also wanted to join Novorussia, but whose resistance was very effectively crushed by the SBU and the Right Sector thugs. The same goes for Mariupol. All these cities now live in an atmosphere of fear, ruled by the death squads and gang of thugs of the local oligarchs to whom these cities were literally *given* by the junta (folks like Kolomoiski or his henchman Palitsa in Odessa). Against Nazis you are always better off resisting to your last bullet and the solution for the Nazi occupied part of the Ukraine is still the same one: resistance, struggle and regime change in Kiev. To blame the war on Putin and/or Strelkov is simply ludicrous.
Then there is the comparison between Crimea and the Donbass. Simply put, there is nothing to compare. These are completely different region with a radically different geography and a completely different ethnic and ideological makeup. To simply say that Putin could have done in Donbass what he did in Crimea completely overlooks the reality on the ground. There is absolutely no reason at all to believe that the people of Novorussia are all united in a desire to become part of Russia like the people in Crimea were. Sure, they did vote for sovereignty, but that could mean anything, from a sovereign entity in a federal or confederal Ukraine, to an independent status to becoming part of the Russian Federation. We should not confuse anti-Nazi feelings and anti-Ukrainian feelings. One can hate the Nazi junta in Kiev and still want to remain Ukrainian in his/her identity. So yes, there are clear signs that the Donbass wants nothing to do with the Nazi regime now in power in Kiev, but from that we cannot automatically conclude that a majority of Novorussians want the Donbass to become part of Russia. This might be changing right now with this war, but we don’t know that yet.
Lastly, there is the issue of Russian global power. Some believe that Russia is weak and simply cannot afford an overt and global struggle against the AngloZionist Empire. They point out, correctly, that Russia is dependent on many foreign imports (pharmaceuticals, computer chips, etc.). Other claim that Russia is almost invulnerable, that it could afford a frontal economic confrontation with the West and prevail. Neither of these claims are true.
Russia is dependent on foreign imports for many things. And there is a lot of Russian money aboard, in UK banks and in offshore accounts. The Russian economy is doing “okay” at best, but with all of the EU in a recession, there are pretty good signs that Russia is getting there too. And this is normal – just 15 years ago Russia was close to becoming a failed state, like the Ukraine today, and what Putin managed is a quasi-miracle, but even quasi-miracles take time and Russia is far, very far, from having truly recovered her health. There are also major systemic problems inside Russia, such as corruption, capital flight, a crazy interest rate policy, most Russian companies incorporated abroad, a sub-par taxing system, etc. Yes, Russia is doing better and better, it has huge reserves of money, natural and human resources, and the long-term prospects are nothing short of excellent. Alas, this already happened in Russia history.
“Give Russia 20 years of peace“ |
The brilliant reformer and Prime Minister of Russia Piotr Stolypin once famously said: “Give Russia 20 years of inner and outer peace and you won’t recognize her.” He was murdered by a revolutionary in 1911 and we all know what happened afterwards. Putin was never given his 20 years of peace either, and it sure does not look that he will ever get it, and neither will Russia, at least not as long as the AngloZionists occupy the planet. And that means that Russia will not recover her full health and her full potential any time soon either. In other words, whether or not Russia could somehow survive a full scale confrontation with the West is immaterial – what matters is that Russia has a strategic interest to do everything in her power to avoid it. This is why Putin is so careful and this is probably why 60% of Russian do not want the Russian military to enter Novorussia: they don’t want to compromise what has been achieved as such great cost and effort by Putin’s Russia in the past 15 years. Again, if there is really no other way to save Novorussia from a Nazi takeover, the Russian military will most probably enter Novorussia. But I think that the Kremlin has a mandate from the Russian people to keep that option as the one for an absolute last resort (with minor or even limited military actions always, and by definition, possible).
The Saker
Cognitive dissonance at its most obvious.
Russian options in the Ukraine:
Well, when Nazi Germany was defeated, the German people were held accountable for the atrocities visited upon others in THEIR NAME. There must and will be an internal resistance to this Nazi take over of the Ukraine sooner or later. Agreed…right now people are cowed and are waiting, hoping but watch… a whole nation cannot be run by gangs without its permission. Terror has its limits. The Ukrainians in my town ( Sacramento) ride around in their SUVs with stickers of Hello Kitty holding a sub machine gun.
Most nazi war criminals were whisked away To USA under opporation paperclip given new identities some still there to this day
Take a look at the poll you site. The .org was formed in in 1987 and lists its partners as Ford Foundation and State.gov.
Flip over to the current employ of polls in Brazil to move the stock market – the sentiment flogger of choice by central banks – as the move to unseat Dilma – prone to speaking out against the IMF and post war financial architecture – is in full swing (like the protests ahead of World Cup and the Sochi like talk down campaign).
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-05-09/rousseff-s-poll-lead-narrows-showing-brazil-runoff-more-probable.html
Then consider this FT article:
Erdogan says same forces behind Brazil and Turkey protests
http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/db155bd4-dbe2-11e2-8853-00144feab7de.html#axzz36thrMvoo
Then the rendition like arrest of the Russian hacker after the alleged Energy grid hack past few days.Dial back to 2013 and the strange foreshadowing by Bloomberg of the social maverick take-down in Russia
http://www.rferl.org/content/us-homeland-security-hacking-seleznyov-russia-arrest/25449250.html
http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2013-08-01/is-pavel-durov-russias-zuckerberg-a-kremlin-target
Pardon me but Donesk oblast and eastern neighbors have some of the largest shale gas in Europe…a most valualble prize considering Crimean gas was taken off the table.
http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2014/04/russia-is-crushing-ukraines-hopes-for-energy-independence/360281/
Hi Saker. Seems to me you’ve outline two different aspects of the US project:
(1) “A unitary (non-federal) Ukraine run by russophobic Nazis completely under US control, with NATO inside the Ukraine and any forms of Russian influence out.” and
(2) “Crimea … under constant threat of attack and, … a Ukie/NATO/US attack on Crimea as soon as enough forces would have been mustered.”
Aspect (2) strikes me as something Russia would have to meet with force of arms under any circumstances, and which it could, given the geography of Crimea – narrow isthmuses, shallow channel into the Sea of Azov, etc. (although the French and British managed to invade during the Crimean War). Aspect (1), however, strikes me as something the Russians could live temporarily with somehow, not go to war about, no matter how unpalatable it might be, while building up their strength to resist Aspect(2).
Dear Saker
This time you are shinning
……First, I have to tell you that the only logical working hypothesis about Putin is that he is doing what he believes is the best for Russia and the Russian people….
———————————
That must be our credo, yardstick or datum. All the rest whici is against it – serves to the enemies of MULTIPOLAR world and Russia.
Zagreb – Moscow
This post is beyond excellent. Only thing I disagree with is the committment of the US deep state to exploiting this situation at Russia’s detriment. Don’t underestimate it.
On 08 July, 2014 16:59 Anonymous wrote
Cognitive dissonance at its most obvious.
What exactly do you mean? Can you please provide more specifics?
Not everyone knows mind reading, is owner of a ouija board or has someone at hand with a working crystal ball.
Thanks in advance,
Б.
I just had a good laugh on account of unpayment for russian gas by ukis in june. The ruskis are duraks.
From a few days ago, when Kramatorsk was still held by the Donbass resistance. This is a part of an interview with American photographer Patrick Lancaster by Vera Graziadei:
Basically, we are in the centre of the city, in the **** Hotel (I removed the name for safety), and near the centre there are at least two different militia compounds. It’s kind of their headquarters. There are a few others throughout the city, but here are the two main ones, I believe.
It’s kind of strange, because in the last five days of the bombing and shelling, we haven’t seen a single militia compound that has actually been hit. Every building that we’ve seen been hit by the Ukrainian mortars have been civilian buildings. We personally seen at least over 40 different civilian buildings bombed, that includes a school, an orphanage – we were in an orphanage the day before yesterday that was hit – and the very many large apartment buildings, like the very big apartment buildings have been hit
Obviously someone gave the orders for deliberately hitting residential areas. It’s the “strategy of tension”: People in fear for their lives are more than willing to accept a tyrant who promises them safety and drastically restricts their freedom.
I interview an American Photographer in Kramatorsk about life under bombs: “The civilians are dying here and something needs to happen to stop it” – Vera Graziadei
Б.
News from the Ukrainian war criminal Igor Kolomoisky:
Ukrainian oligarch Igor Kolomoisky is using Ukrainian crisis to overcome his rivals. He has proposed to confiscate the property of those businessmen, who support the Federal State of Novorossiya, his aide, Boris Filatov said, citing the oligarch.
Ukrainian oligarch Kolomoisky proposes to confiscate property of Novorossiya supporters – Voice of Russia
Б.
женя Псакий aka. Psakibot has proclaimed her latest teleprompted and scripted wisdom:
Asked by the RT reporter Gayane Chichakyan of civilians who are suffering from the bombing, which is conducted exactly by the Ukrainian army, and not from the actions of the militia, Jen Psaki said that Kiev has the right to do it, so it protects the integrity of the country. “The Ukrainian authorities are protecting the country. I think they have to have every right to do it, it is the same way to act in the international community,” she said.
In addition, Psaki commented recent statement of US State Department Spokesperson Marie Harf that Ukrainians do not leave the country because of the crisis, but just go to visit grandparents in Russia. She explained that the US cannot believe the sources that report about increase of emigrants’ flow.
US State Department recognizes right of Kiev to apply airstrikes on civilians – Voice of Russia
Б.
Mr.Put is loosing big time in the eyes of international community.
Strelkov’s retreat from Slavyansk to Donetsk was caused not only by the defence of Slavyansk becoming untenable, but also by the urgent need to organise the proper defence of Donetsk. This had not been done in months because, frankly, many factions there were not interested in defending Donetsk at all. Enough to mention that, unlike in Lugansk, nobody even tried to prevent Ukrainian planes from landing at the Donetsk airport and bringing supplies to the troops there. Oligarch Akhmetov’s money prayed a large role in this. This is another reason why Strelkov’s retreat had to be a complete surprise to everyone. Strelkov needed to ambush Akhmetov’s people and other pro-Ukies and prevent them from taking measures against him. Apparently as soon as Strelkov appeared in Donetsk, there was a flood of pro-Ukie officials, police etc. fleeing the city – up until then they had felt perfectly safe and comfortable there. Now Strelkov is trying to do what should have been done in months in just days. We shall see how successful he is.
Saker,
I concur.
Additional polling shows German populace wants better and closer ties with Russia. 60+ % want less relationship with the U.S.
These things matter in the calculations Putin makes.
Long term thinking and crucial timing are the techniques for success.
The Hegemon is on its high horse in the world, but it never faced such challenges. Russia is but one defying force. China is another, and they are coordinating everywhere around the globe and in tandem.
The entire non-aligned world is defying the Hegemon. The BRICS, Latin America, South Asia, Central Asia—we can see alliance with Russia and China, not the U.S.
Actually, there is more chaos and death as the Hegemon unleashes death machines like ISIS and Right Sector/Ukies. However, the body counts are to terrify. They are not indicators of Hegemon power and influence. They signify desperation and loss of control.
Whenever the Tyranny can only rule by death and destruction, it is on its way to Hades.
The Elites of the West require genocide to maintain their hold on their greed machine. They don’t even have an ideological slogan or concept to sell to the masses. They are a global version of Privy Sector in three thousand dollar suits. And they are terrified of Vladimir Putin and the Orthodox Church morality of the Russian people.
A tiny history of false flag operations from around the world:
A major with the Nazi SS admitted at the Nuremberg trials that – under orders from the chief of the Gestapo – he and some other Nazi operatives faked attacks on their own people and resources which they blamed on the Poles, to justify the invasion of Poland. Nazi general Franz Halder also testified at the Nuremberg trials that Nazi leader Hermann Goering admitted to setting fire to the German parliament building, and then falsely blaming the communists for the arson
[…]
Soviet leader Nikita Khrushchev admitted in writing that the Soviet Union’s Red Army shelled the Russian village of Mainila in 1939, and declared that the fire originated from Finland as a basis launching the Winter War four days later
[…]
The British Prime Minister admitted to his defense secretary that he and American president Dwight Eisenhower approved a plan in 1957 to carry out false flag attacks in Syria and blame it on the Syrian government as a way to effect regime change
Governments from Around the World – Including Western, Islamic, Asian and African Nations – ADMIT They Carry Out False Flag Terror – Washington’s Blog
Б.
Well, first, Russia would hate to immediately cut it off from the Common Trade Zone (to protect Russia, Belarus, Kazakhstan, Armenia and future members) from EU goods.
Think of it this way: if I point a gun at hour chest and say ‘your money or your life’ you do, I suppose, have kind of a “choice”, but we don’t really call that a choice, do we?
Saker, please correct “hate” to “have” and “hour” to “”your”. (And check on translated pages.) Thx.
oh well, its nice writeup to prettify the situation for novorusia.
problems:
1. incoherent leadership.
2. inability to agree and act as one body. Big failure of leadership.
3. lobotomized general population, sitting and waiting for “help to come”. Inability to act is result of 20 years of societal structures destruction, and moral values destruction. This is very big problem.
4. inability to find decent arms.
5. questionable economic and financial state.
6. local organisation in shambles, looting and drinking is frequently reported.
7. I wish local leaders to dissapear and get replaced by the poorest citizens, they would look more after others interests, they would know humility, and compassion. I am pissed from their internal struggles for power.
upsides:
1. Strelkov. The guy is absolutely great leader and motivator. Look at his body language in the interviews.. masses will follow him.Thanks god, they have one decent man.
2. Slow but steady forming of nationality, feeling of unity, common goals.
3. The process of forming army is almost complete.
Whatsnext:
Novorusia needs “game changer”, anything but has to be gamechanger. I have no idea what would could it be. I wish another region joins the effort.. that would be perfect game changer.
I do not believe that nazis will stop now, now that they are “winning”. If they go like this it will be all over in a month or so, they need to hold it till start of the winter. I wish another region joins the effort.. that would be perfect game changer.
So, situation is pretty bleak.. and dont tell me what are putins interests or what he can do or not do. These guys are like unexplored bomb, and putin is not going to juggle it. Fix the pin, and the things will go on THEIR OWN to better, putin can go on vacation and do nothing.
OK, regime change… no clear road to an acceptable comprehensive solution until 60 or 70% of the population has decided Russia is not the enemy. Here’s hoping that occurs sooner rather than later.
Personally I am waiting to see what the reorganized militia forces do with their current opportunity. Some clear military successes would go quite a ways for them at this point, and would embolden those in other regions.
Anonymous 17:07 – people had given up resisting the gangster state with no idea how to fight it. The bulk of the legitimate Maidan protesters were angry about rule by kleptocratic gangsters. Seen “Lords of War”? Ukraine was already a failed state on life support from those evil Russians. Now it is a disaster.
…The US, the EU or even the AngloZionist empire as a whole has exactly zero need for the Donbass. Russia yes, Russia could definitely use much of the potential of the Donbass, but not anybody else. Now, if the Donbass is handed over the the Nazi-controlled rump-Ukraine (what I call Banderastan) it will thereby and automatically lose any and all of its value: cut off from Russia, the Donbass is useless…
Not saying that it’s the main goal of the USA (which is to practice their new strategy of “leading from behind” in readiness for their moves on Russia and China), but what you say here ignores the greed for the very valuable chernozems in the east (and across the border in the Russian steppe too), which Monsanto, Dow, Syngenta and Bayer are simply drooling over. Russia (and hitherto Ukraine) is among the few holding out against GM seed blackmail and large enough to have resisted deliberate contamination of seed banks. There’s also clearance in readiness for Shell colonisation of the east.
Excellent analysis Saker.
Also: Ukrainian army forced back from Lugansk – LPR head
http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_07_08/Ukrainian-army-forced-back-from-Lugansk-LPR-head-1755/
here we go again!
Tuesday, July 8
18:13 GMT:
Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko has agreed to negotiate with the region’s population over the fate of eastern Ukraine, a statement on his website says.
“President Petro Poroshenko has said that he is ready for negotiations over the future fate of Donbas with everyone who really represents the people of the region and is prepared for political dialogue,” the statement reads.
http://rt.com/news/eastern-ukraine-army-operation-680/
@The Saker
With my ever shortening attention span this is the only kind of article I can swallow in a single gulp and still feel hungry for more. In other words, your article is based on the best balance between absolute accessibly and depth of the analysis. No compromise, no nonsense – just a great joy to read.
I think the ‘deep state” always has multiple goals, most of which is often achieved through the creation of chaos. Chaos is debilitating and ultimately a huge drain psychologically and economically for those who have to detangle the knots of disorder (in this case Russia) . It is so much easier to shit all over than to clean that shit. Russia needs to do two things -to constipate America or to starve it, so that it cannot keep using the world as its toilet bowl. De-dollarization might achieve this goal in about 6 years, until then it is all about political acrobatics and chess playing; as we all know Russia can do both extremely well.
The entire Ukraine has to be de-Nazified . If any of these weeds are left untouched, it is only a matter of time before the whole field is polluted again. Germany and the US government being engaged in Matrix-sizing, brainwashing and deep conditioning of Ukrainians for a long, long time. It was their TARGET. Now it is Russia’s turn to do undo the damage. It has to be proactive and it has to make it into a TARGET.
Kiev is the birth place of Russia and it has to be treated as such. .
Anon 17:12:
Pardon me but Donesk oblast and eastern neighbors have some of the largest shale gas in Europe…a most valualble prize considering Crimean gas was taken off the table.
Ukraine’s entire natural gas reserves are a ROUNDING ERROR in Russia’s natural gas reserves, which don’t include any accounting of shale gas in Russia. If Russia really needed more gas reserves (which it does not), its near abroad in Central Asia has an order of magnitude more gas than Ukraine and would be far easier to take over militarily.
This fight is hardly over the Yuzivska Shale Gas field won by Shell Oil either. That field, if developed (something which can’t be stated with certainty until the test wells actually show economic potential) was slated to produce 10-12% of Ukraine’s annual needs, while Ukraine imports 60% of its gas consumption. The political calculus for Ukraine does not change between 50% imports from Russia and 60% imports from Russia.
Also regarding Yuzivska field, a few facts are in order in relation to the hysteria posted here a couple of days ago with respect to Shell needing the land above it to be ethnically cleansed to drill. This would certainly be a strange plan given that Shell won the franchise for this field from Yanukovich, who counted this area among his strongest political supporters. Such people would have us believe not only that Ukrainian Nazis are after these poor people, but that Yanukovich had betrayed them as well for a few dollars. The Yuzivska field is around 3000 sq. miles, which means it will need possibly 1500-3000 well pads if fully developed (each pad has multiple wells and covers 1-2 sq. miles – 640-1280 acres. The well pads are typically 10 acres each during drilling (the footprint can shrink later unless re-fracking is desired), so 1.5% of the land is required during drilling to support the drilling activity. Most of the people in the area, of course, live in towns and villages, and it would hardly make sense to depopulate these compactly settled areas to locate well pads when they could be put in a field outside of town. If the drilling were to proceed in an orderly manner over the course of about 50 years (which was the planned life), and lets double the pad size to 20 acres, you come out needing 1200 acres of land per year to drill on, or about 2 square miles in a field of 3000 square miles in a country of 230,000 square miles. The necessity of a highly destructive war and a bloody genocidal ethnic cleansing to accomplish this seems extremely dubious when gas drilling in shale is accomplished across the US without resorting to such means.
Making these kind of assertions simply hurts the credibility of the Novorossiyan struggle, which is a straightforward fight between Russians and Ukrainians, and between Russia and US/NATO.
Donbass region is sitting on top of one of the largest shale gas reserves in Europe! It is very valuable real estate and the deal with Chevron (I think) is that people have to be removed for the 1500 wells to be drilled….
First, there is no real evidence that Russia has ever provided the separatists with any military or financial aid. Didn’t Putin tell them not to have a referendum.
Second, how did the separatists manage to capture or “find” all of the military equipment which they now have?
Third, who has supplied all of the money needed for their uniforms, food, etc.
Forth, how did a small ad hoc unit manage to hold off the entire Ukie Army for two months and then to escape from total encirclement?
The question is: are the Ukies really so incompetent or maybe the people who are directing their activities (we all know who that is!) are really helping the separatists. One may ask, How this could be?
It is obvious that since they realized they would lose Crimea, the strategy of the West has been to coerce Russia to invade all of Ukraine. Of course it would be a disaster- a continuous civil war in a bankrupt country for which Russia would now have to finance.
Therefore, assure that neither side wins and continue the war as long as possible (and maybe Russia will someday invade).
Actually, this is a cloud with a silver lining for Russia as it gives them an opportunity to promote ties with non-western countries, stop using the dollar, engage in import substitution by building new factories, etc.
Russia will not invade Ukraine unless it has to because total anarchy with nationwide rioting following a Ukie government collapse. The best course for Russia is to shut down their Ukraine operations and welcome millions of new residents for the many new jobs which will be available for them.
Thanks Saker, I like this post a lot. Only thing I feel that I need to point out is please do not count on “the collapse of the entire Banderastani state is inevitable within the next 4-6 months”. You really do not know if EU/US plan to prop it up a little longer or not, or something else they can find to sell. How ever, NAF can put some pressure on it rail network through out country to help speed up the process.
“The notion that he is a “coward” or that he “sold out” is at prima facie ridiculous:”
At some point — and the window of alternate explanations is shrinking fast — we have to accept that Emperor Putin in wearing no clothes. It’s nigh time to adjust our analyses accordingly.
Yes, precisely. While the hysterics and the pro Imperialists heap their derision on the Russian President for not annexing Novorossiya lat month, Putin is playing the game to regain the WHOLE of Ukraine as a neutral state. Not merely Novorossiya as a small addition to the RF. He cant afford yet to frighten the rest of the Ukrainian people and will only attack to head off a NATO movement into the country. NATO, knowing this, will NOT move into the war.
I’m surprised and wonder why you have not shared some of Aleksandr Dugin’s recent analysis. According to him, Putin is not really a Eurasionist per se but an arbiter between the pro-West and Eurasionist factions, and now that balance is breaking and Putin will have to make a choice. Or maybe he already has…
I would go further and suggest that Putin is a near-prisoner of the interests of Russians own oligarchs, who place their own ill-gotten financial interests above those of a few “white-trash” Russians in the Donbass (to use a Southern expression still used by white elites to describe poor, oppressed white people in their midst.)
Putting the interests of the wealthy over those of the oppressed — even one’s own people — is common enough to constitute another “logical explanation”.
Your argument outwardly closely mirrors that of those who supported the bailout of the banks in the US. It had to be done in the national interest. No, it had to be done in the interest of America’s own oligarchs.
Dear Saker,
This is completely off topic, I apologize, but it’s extremely disturbing. It’s an article about Timoshenko’s involvement in organ trafficking. I don’t think its propaganda since they did this in Kosovo already. Carla Del Ponte published the whole network involved in “yellow house” case, including Bernard Kuchner and doctors and hospitals from Israel. I don’t know the details, but there’s a network of countries and high officials involved in organ trafficking. Maybe you could write something about this.
http://www.kp.ru/daily/26252.7/3132016/
Kind regards.
In what ways does the current Banderistan differ from the Weimar Republic? Both countries are/were economic basket cases. Both were nominal democracies. Both were eventually overrun by Nazis. However, the latter morphed into one of the greatest military machines the world has ever known. How can we be certain that if Russia leaves Ukraine alone, Ukraine won’t (couldn’t) do the same?
Thank you Saker and all of your co-workers.
” if that had been the case, he would not have ordered the Russian forces to snatch the Crimean Peninsula right under the nose of the US and NATO.”
Proves nothing except a failed strategy. Unless a rabbit is pulled out of the hat soon — and the window is steadily closing — then Putin’s epitaph will be the following:
*Vladimir Putin won the battle [Crimea] and lost the war [Ukraine]*
Along the lines of the above: With the deepest respect, it appears to this reader that the rest of the analysis reflects more wishful thinking than fact.
This reader sincerely hopes you will look at Putin and his actions more critically in future analyses. A discussion on your part of Aleksandr Dugin’s recent criticisms of Putin [mentioned in my earlier comment] — in the context of the pro-West and Eurasionist tensions in Russia — would also be appropriate at this time.
Hi Saker,
sorry for my poor english…
I would suggest another possible objective of the junta and their puppets.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/25/business/global/ukraine-signs-drilling-deal-with-shell-for-shale-gas.html?_r=0
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-11-08/shell-to-drill-first-wells-in-10-billion-ukrainian-project.html
So the Donbass is not so useless. And Giulietto Chiesa, a italian reporter, said the contract signed by Yanukovic would allow Shell to displace people of their land and home if needed… if this were true even a fully destroyed Donbass will be a good thing for Shell and other companies.
M.
How many Ukrainians will participate in future elections with nazi minions like Lyashko & Timoshenko ? Polls will never give us this figure, which shows percent of people, who are not intrested about voting for other thief. In Poland less than half of population, allowed to vote, (aproximetly 40%) participate in this comedy called democracy, where minority decides about fate of the country.
Andrew,
Hi Saker,
sorry for my poor english…
I would suggest another possible objective of the junta and their puppets.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/25/business/global/ukraine-signs-drilling-deal-with-shell-for-shale-gas.html?_r=0
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-11-08/shell-to-drill-first-wells-in-10-billion-ukrainian-project.html
So the Donbass is not so useless. And Giulietto Chiesa, a italian reporter, said the contract signed by Yanukovic would allow Shell to displace people of their land and home if needed… if this were true even a fully destroyed Donbass will be a good thing for Shell and other companies.
They point out, correctly, that Russia is dependent on many foreign imports (pharmaceuticals, computer chips, etc.)
I suspect that this is true and why recently and moves are underway to loosen themselves from the strangehold:
Russian visa
http://rt.com/business/167272-russia-national-payment-system/
microchips for defence:
http://www.kommersant.com/p1016170/r_500/Sitronics_microchips/
huge expansion in GLONASS
(many moons ago, as a navigator, I scoffed at GLONASS, patchy and Soviet. but now I understand the long journey and persistence: another option from the US’s GPS.
Russia is even bringing China onboard:
http://en.itar-tass.com/non-political/739377
I suspect that the Russians could see a showdown, but now the timeframe has moved quicker.. Liberating themselves from Western weak points, especially in the defence & technology.
Putin and the Kremlin still have a lot of their work cut out, imo, especially in high level research and university fields.
Olivegreen thanks for that bit of news at 17:52. I will take some satisfaction in watching Strelkov’s army achieve the miraculous over the next few months. I gather they’ve already performed assassinations of Ukie military personnel – I look forward to the turn of the oligarchs.
One thing I noticed is how the Donbass Army evacuates the families of its fighters as a high priority. This happened in the withdrawal from Slavyansk too, and I’ve seen it as a common theme during these last months.
Meanhwile Saker says: “they voted for independence en masse, now they will have to defend that choice, also en masse.” Agreed.
Meanwhile also the horror of the Nazis will come to every place in Ukraine and as Saker points out, the Nazis have no agenda other than acting like Nazis. The only way to deal with these Nazis is to kill them.
So as this message sinks in across the territory, able-bodied men and women should also see that the best way to save your family is to join the Donbass Army and fight the Nazis…that’s a large motivator.
What fighters this army already has and will have – people clear in their minds that their families are safe no matter what happens to them, and that their only life’s purpose now is to cleanse their land of the filth that brought the terror in the first place.
I can think of no more highly motivated fighter than this. Honestly, I have no doubt that Novorossiya will prevail.
SAKER -“Give Russia 20 years of peace”
The brilliant reformer and Prime Minister of Russia Piotr Stolypin once famously said: “Give Russia 20 years of inner and outer peace and you won’t recognize her.” He was murdered by a revolutionary in 1911 and we all know what happened afterwards.”
Yes he was murdered by Bogrov. An Anarchist and an informant for the Okhrana. What happened afterward is Russia, an absolute monarchy, was led needlessly into WW1 by the Czar. Perhaps the call for 20 years of peace worried some powerful Oligarchs. The investigation of Stolypin’s assassination was later discontinued at the express order of Nicholas II.
Might have slipped past some folks lately, but Serbian leaders have been meeting Russian ones..
http://en.itar-tass.com/russia/739344
Can’t help but notice that there have been quite a few in the last one month or so.
“the Russian and Serbian prime ministers were set to discuss a wide range of bilateral trade and economic cooperation including the implementation of bilateral large-scale projects in the energy and infrastructure spheres.”
Does that mean the Serbian leaders are coming to their senses and getting cold feet over the EU?
well, if Russia would move on to Ukraine, they would loose it forever. They simply can`t do it at current circumstances. NR has to survive on it`s own (with Russia help, but no interference) and Kiev has to do what they will do so the whole Ukraine will see what they are.,
On 08 July, 2014 18:19 rob wrote:
[Porky and truce]
here we go again!
Interesting. There is however a catch in the announcement:
President Petro Poroshenko has said that he is ready for negotiations over the future fate of Donbas[s] with everyone who really represents the people of the region and is prepared for political dialogue
(emphasis mine).
Of course it’s up to Porky to decide whether someone “really” represents the interests. In other words, if he doesn’t like someone because s/he looks funny, there won’t be any new negotiations. Hence, presumably just posturing in front of Western cameras and microphones so the EU, with its master the US-Empire, can issue the usual threats of sanctions…
Б.
@ cardinal points,
The West always reminds me of the Strangler fig. One can call the remains ‘democracy,’ but I’d rather watch testicular acupuncture than having to face more western induced Hasbara BS, proclaiming to [barf] ‘liberate’ [more barf].
It’s The Economy Stupid! Part one of two
Everyone is framing this as a war. Even you Saker.
To a degree you are right to do so but a mistake is being made in discussing the ‘war’ in militaristic terms.
This is about economics: the allocation of scarce resources and the conflict is apparent on several levels.
We can talk about our favourite bogey men and some of us might even be right in terms of their guesses.
On another level though, what is happening in Ukraine is about economics too. Here’s a truth:
no war can be won by the actor with the least good control of requisite resources.
What that means is that unless a ‘side’ has enough resources to outlast the enemy and to drive a military victory then the war can not be won. What may result is a stand-off as in Gaza where 1.7 million people are jammed into a sliver of land some 7 miles by 20 (360 km2) The Israelis can’t win because the resource they lack is the will to succeed.
The Palestinians can’t win because they lack all resources except birthrate.
So what is the situation in Ukraine?
The government is bankrupt but has cash flows. They can use those cash flows to buy in the materiel they need. Nominally at least they can pay the wages of the military and militias. As long as they have cash flows, from whatever sources they can continue.
The rebels, what do they have: nothing.
Weapons picked up at the side of the road and stripped from the bodies of dead men.
Little or no ability to provide food and water.
No significant cash flows
Little or no functioning munitions industry
The people might fight in the summer, but what about the winter with no electricity, water, food or heat?
Russia has made it clear that they are not going to support the rebels. It is obvious that there is informal assistance but that does not win a war. If the government wanted to do more then they run the risk of being seen as supporting the rebellion in a non-deniable manner.
My opinion is that the rebels have done a great job militarily – but then it is obvious that the opposition is hardly even conference league level (sorry, English football reference there).
So what does that mean?
I reckon that there are three outcomes available. I will not go into the effects of those outcomes, just mention what they are.
1) A slow and grinding military defeat leading to a dissolution of the rebellion. My guess is that surrender is not an option for anyone wishing to live.
2) By virtue of minimal ‘informal’ support from across the border the struggle continues indefinitely and for similar reasons to the Gaza situation, but with a lower birthrate. The rebels unable to project power further than their de facto borders and the Ukrainians not wanting to enforce the genocide that is the only real option absent a negotiated settlement.
3) A negotiated settlement of some kind that is enough to, at the least, save face on both sides. However, right now the government is not going to be able to accept that – the real powers both locally and remotely will not allow it.
It’s The Economy Stupid! Part two of two
However, the only way to force a negotiation, as far as I can see is this: The rebels need to learn about asymmetrical warfare. Now, I am not an armchair general, I am a small economist.
Asymmetric warfare is the group of techniques that enable a force with limited resources to be able to achieve a high value for each life (or other unit of resource) that is used and lost.
To put it bluntly, the only way that this civil war can end is when the people in the eastern oblasti become comfortable with killing civilians, cutting people’s arms and heads off and making sure that on the evening news from Kiev that some new atrocity has been carried out.
Make the civilians on the western regions shout up loudly enough to call a halt. Right now the cost to the government of this war is small. They are fighting with OPM (other people’s money). They need to start paying the price in a different coin.
Of course this is not a risk free option. It could be that Ukraine’s military and militias strap on their balls and go on the offensive but, frankly, I think that if they could’ve done they would’ve done. We are probably seeing the best that Ukraine can do. This means that as long as the rebels get a resource lifeline then option (2) above would be in play.
So, in the final analysis, this is a battle of economies. The Ukrainians are much better set than the rebels. In order to prevail the rebels need to find a way to increase the value of tier resources and/or increase the price paid by the citizens of Ukraine.
To the “Putin is a traitor” crowd.
Russia certainly has its share of gangsterism and self-serving oligarchs, no denying… as do most countries. Healthy skepticism and a little cynicism is also in order when judging human motives.
That said what do we see Russia doing? Working hard to solidify support for South Stream and trade relationships in general. Announcing moves to protect the Russian economy and banking sector from malicious attacks through diversification of suppliers and encouraging within country development of key industries and sectors. Keeping open channels of communication with all parties – friendly, ambivalent, or semi hostile BUT also matching NATO exercises toe to toe and demonstrating Russia’s military readiness with various exercises on Russian territory. Supporting Syria, Iran, and the existing Iraqi government in their disputes and conflicts with the west. Defending the militia’s right in Novorussia to demand fair parley terms. Not closing the border with Ukraine. Caring for thousands of Ukrainian refugees. Working to get talks going on fair terms with the support of key European partners (responsible diplomacy even if the hope of success is small). Opening criminal cases against perpetrators of atrocities in Ukraine. Clearly stating Russia’s position on issues of contention (in contrast to the doublespeak so often practiced in international relations).
Sure, the proof is in the pudding, but the pudding ain’t done yet. I say so far so good.
The Zombie Garrison
It is true that the state of Ukraine is finished – almost – but beware of the living dead. The economic pressure will only accelerate what is the plan of the Empire – to convert Ukraine into a cheap soldier garrison.
Us/Nato sponsored ground force to attack Russia – cannon-fodder wholesale.
That is maybe the reason why they almost try not to destroy the resistance because they need the rebellion to justify the build-up of an gigantic Nato sponsored force.
Q
Also, as has been said many times, overt Russian military intervention would be an occupation at present. Conditions do not warrant it despite the terrible situation. Ukrainians as a whole need to realize the junta government is against their interests before this could happen successfully.
The Guardian moderators should just replace all the pro-American comments with ‘Glory to Ukraine!’ . . . it would improve the level of discourse.
Saker, overall good analysis except that there is an economic interest in this region as mentioned by many others. Look here right on the border there are gas fields
http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/73340000/gif/_73340564_ukraine_gas_pipelines_624_v3.gif
The strategic objective for NATO and Ukies is to negate the use of these pipelines to Russia as it allows for Russia to exert political and economic influence in Europe.
This is why they are so vehemently opposed to the South Stream Pipeline project construction. If South Stream is built it by passes Ukraine and it would negate the strategic importance of Ukraine.
One thing the Russian oligarchs do not want is a Novorussia leadership with ideas of expropiating property from Novorussian or Ukrainian oligarchs.
As they say in Games of Thrones, Winter is Coming!
Dear Saker,
This is one of your best analysis in your past weeks.Patience will bring miracles what we are waiting for a very long time.
Those Ukrainian officers were dismissed because the whole purpose of the blockade was to finish off Strelkov forces in Slaviank. Letting him flee intact to fight another day was never the Ukies plan.
Remember how Poroshenko promised that this was going to be over in hours? the longer this is dragged out, the more blood and treasure is spent and the more disenchanted everybody becomes with his leadership.
Time is not in the Junta’s side. The more punishment and destruction he inflicts in the Donbass the more people are going to hate him for generations. I am sure his advisers remind him to get it over soon. But so far, Strelkov has held NATO at bay. They must be incredibly pissed, impatient, frustrated and hating the guy’s guts.
On 08 July, 2014 18:22 Andrew wrote:
Also regarding Yuzivska field, a few facts are in order in relation to the hysteria posted here a couple of days ago with respect to Shell needing the land above it to be ethnically cleansed to drill.
Andrew, with all due respect, that’s a strawman argument you are pulling. Nobody has ever claimed it needed to be “ethnically cleansed”:
In accordance with article 37.2 of the agreement, the local residents have to sell their land and property. In case of refusal they are to be coerced to do it to serve the Shell’s interests. The company’s expenditure is to be compensated by Ukraine at the expense of produced gas.
source: http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2014/07/06/donbass-russians-subject-unparalleled-ethnic-cleansing.html
Could become an issue for returning storm troopers who want to claim their promised land and get instead royally shafted. Then take into account the nasty impacts fracking has on ground water and soil (if needed/wanted I can provide links to articles)
You are correct that Yanukovich, in his infinite wisdom, signed the deal.
Б.
Extended guerilla warfare is the way to go. In a Nazi terror state that runs on cash and guns, easy to pull off. Russian army coming in now would make things worse. Russia will be the peacemaker, there is no sense in which ‘Ukraine’ is not Russia. It might take 20 years for effective de-Nazification. The West will pull every trick in the book, but ultimately they can’t operate effectively in this environment and create real solutions. The endgame is that ‘Ukraine’ will come back home to Russia.
‘Ukraine’ (in whatever form) will emerge as the peaceful, beautiful land and people that it always was meant to be. Russia will help it. Lucky for the world that Putin is a patriot of Russia and will be involved in the process. If the US and Europe are sane, they will beg his help and allow him free reign.
From what I can see, Russia is doing what is always has done. For centuries. Napoleon, Hitler… evacuate the women and children to the east and to safety. Thanks to the separatist military, who have held off the Kiev thugs, they have bought time since Odessa, which was a clear message as to how Kiev was going to behave. Thousands of women and children have been moved to safety. If not for the separatist military, this opportunity would have been lost. They have done a great job. If not for them, thousands more lives would be lost and many would be put into camps and jail. The defense of Donesk will buy more time to get more people out and to safety. Then all they need to do is wait for winter , turn the gas off and watch as Ukraine goes completely bankrupt. The advancing Kiev thugs will be stuck in eastern Ukraine with no food, no water, no infrastructure because they will have destroyed it all. Happy camping! And it will most probably be one of the worst winters in history! Nastarovia!
Saker, I really hope you are right, but sometimes I think you may be too cought up in the idea that geopolitics works as a consequence of the interests of nation states, rather than the interests of their oligarcs. Specifically, you acknowledge a “deep state” that is supposed to be directing the actions of the US administration on this matter. But you never, as far as I can remember, acknowlege a symmetrical deep state in Russia. You speak as if everything begins and ends with what Putin decides, and as if what Putin decides were actually always his own decisions. Russia is a capitalist state whose economy is run by oligarcs. These people must have some serious influence in government decisions, especially those concerning grave matters.
No doubt Russia (the nation-state) should not tolerate a Russophobe neonazi freak show in Ukraine. But what if the Russian deep state has decided they can live with that and made the corresponding agreements with the guys calling the shots in the US and Europe?
I agree that Putin probably calls the shots in Russia to a greater extent than Obama does in the US. But is Putin really in complete charge here? Can he do what he really wants to do?
Russia’s top diplomat on Tuesday criticized Kiev’s demands that militiamen in Ukraine’s embattled south-eastern regions capitulate. “We see everything thanks to correspondents who work risking their lives, and (we see) how solemn words of (Ukrainian) President Poroshenko that the Ukrainian army was ordered not to shell cities, settlements and residential quarters, not to bomb civilians, reflect reality,” Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said. “What is happening is totally different,” Lavrov said. “We see killed people, deformed bodies, destroyed apartments, houses. This is dismal.” “Statements from the Ukrainian authorities that truce is only possible if militiamen accept the peace plan, that is, capitulate, and hope to be pardoned, discourage us and remove any opportunities for reaching the truce,” he said.
There is a subtle, but noticable difference between an anarchist and some agent provocateur posing as one:
Bogrov, while simultaneously acting as an anarchist revolutionary, had been an agent of the Okhrana secret police since 1906, informing on the activities of Socialist Revolutionaries, Social Democrats and anarchists.
and
However, it has been alleged that Bogrov was permitted to act at the behest of extreme right-wing elements in the Tsarist secret police who detested Stolypin because of his agrarian reforms and his flair for parliamentary government. (Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn extensively investigates and gives full credit to this conjecture in his historical novel August 1914.)
source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dmitry_Bogrov
Anarchism != Anarchy
What is Anarchism? – Anarchist FAQ
Б.
Saker
There is some reports that the men in Slavyansk being rounded up are given a choice of prison or “penal battalions.” I have a couple of thoughts on this, if this information is accurate.
1. These battalions are nothing more than suicide units designed to make the enemy waste ammunition.
2. This could backfire on Kiev. Seeing as these men are likely going to die anyways, they could potentially perform acts of sabotage. I don’t think this is entirely impossible, as the competency of the Ukrainian Army hasn’t really impressed me or many other people.
Another excellent analysis, Saker, and belated congratulations on all of yesterday’s totally wonderful news. WOW!
I’d like to add a couple of points if I may, though the first few do go counter a bit to what you said regarding us and Kiev. And that is that I *believe* the Donbass is where all the oil/gas/fracking interests is being planned. If that is the case, the damaged infrastructure is as irrelevant to TPTB as the people whose families have lived there for 1000 years: what’s under the ground is all that matters. Secondly, another factor in terms of “Kiev’s” goals might be simply to get Pravy Sektor the hell out of Dodge, permanently if possible — and they frankly owe the militias a huge debt of gratitude for dispatching so many of them. But I also fear you might be a bit too hopeful as regards the demise not of Galician Banderastan per se, but of its mentality: hatred, self-pity and scapegoating are a really hideous combination and wither very slowly, most especially when defeated.
But especially after reading New Insight’s comment the other day regarding what happened to Iraq, Iran and Libya for daring to challenge our dollar hegemony, I realized Putin really has been playing hardball, and doing it the right way, too. My heart is still crying for the innocents slaughtered but those people are *our* moral responsibility, not his. We have an exceedingly violent and militaristic culture and tend to react in ways carefully inculcated by TV, comic books and the like. So we’ve been waiting for him to swoop in like Superman or the Lone Ranger and make us all feel better because to our minds the only real solution is a bigger bang-bang from a bigger gun? That’s not hardball and as you said, it’s hardly a solution either: in fact, it pretty well defines the problem. Hardball is out-thinking, out-strategizing, accomplishing your goals with the fewest losses possible — and doing that against the Anglo-Zionist Empire and its European satraps is no mean feat.
I see his goals as first, continuing to build a healthier, stronger Russia — in which he (unlike more than a handful of our leaders, ever) obviously includes in that the welfare of the Russian people. But it’s his second goal that’s the biggie: demolishing our hegemony and replacing it with a robust multi-polarism based on political and economic cooperation and adherence to International Law. So, in so overtly holding back he’s not only countering our outrageous attempts to scapegoat him; far, far more importantly, he’s demonstrating to his counterparts in Europe a peaceful, lawful and egalitarian relationship totally different what they now have with us. And that, in combination with Russia’s more than fair pipeline policies, the lure of the New Silk Road, China, etc. has got to give pause to all but the obvious Eurobureaucrats. It’s an amazing balancing act, and he’s doing it superbly.
An article on what it means to fight in the Donbass for all the peoples of Europe, no less than the front (armed) against fascism and the neoliberal model.
As the author, it is important to succeed, not only for the future of the people of Novorussia and Russia herself, but for the hope of the people. Imagine that they (the Nazi thugs ) went well. Regardless of the economic or geopolitical objectives, is also an excellent testing ground for the management of possible insurgency in a context of widespread poverty and misery and the degree of tolerance of public opinion. IMO, not only Novorusian, or Russians, but we all play a lot in this.
As professor Monedero says, “fear should switch sides”, right now!
http://www.rebelion.org/noticia.php?id=187002
Maybe for the the first time, the militia has money. They “found” it in Privatbank owned by Igor Kolomoisky. The oligarch is now unwillingly funding the militia. It is hilarious.
The militiamen will be paid from now on and I expect many more will sign on.
Ukraine’s deputy prime minister told international donors on Tuesday that a $17 billion International Monetary Fund bailout was “not enough” because of “unprecedented Russian-inspired aggression”. LINK to Wake up from your…. zzzzzzzzzzzzzz
When do we need those $$$$$$?
We need them now!
I hope they’ll get enough paper money come winter time…
Looks like Porky thinks he can do a deal with Akhmetov.
From ITAR-TASS:
“The head of state talked with the people and assured them that the authorities were doing their best to restore normal life in the city as soon as possible,” the presidential press service said.
Poroshenko expressed hope that he would also be able to visit Donetsk and Lugansk soon too. He said the army operation in the region, commonly known as Donbas, was “a battle for Ukraine’s independence. This is how our nation is being tempered”.
The president said his peace plan would be implemented by all means. “There is no doubt that the peace plan will be implemented. It has won the support of the whole world, Slavyansk, Druzhkovka, Konstantinovka and Artemovsk. And it will be supported in Donetsk and Lugansk as well,” he said.
Poroshenko said he was ready for a dialogue with those who are prepared to lay down their arms and accept decentralisation. The leadership of the country is prepared for a dialogue with those “who are ready to give up arms and use future amnesty”, who “are ready for a political dialogue in order to elect new authorities” and those who support the restoration of peace in Donbas.
He believes it necessary to enlarge the list of people who represent Donbas in order to resume the peace talks. “The talks must be resumed with the real masters of Donbas: metallurgists, miners and people who represent the biggest force today but who were pressed down by the power of weapons,” he said.”
http://en.itar-tass.com/world/739571
Can you say betrayal? Some folks REALLY need to watch their backs.
An anonymous poster said that Putin won the battle (Crimea) but lost the war (Ukraine).
Not quite.
The Head of the Russian State has been trying to integrate Russia into the world system on respectable terms. Sochi was meant to be the capstone to that worthy and sensible project.
The Jews et al. took that opportunity to stab Putin in the back and slap Russia in the face via the Ukraine. He took Crimea as an act or desperation in order to stop the bleeding.
The Donbas was a target of opportunity, but not a strategic necessity. He has sacrificed it in order to pursue his new objective, which is rapid de-dollarization of world trade en route to a multi-polar world.
That is The War, and Putin is winning that war. I’m sad to say that the people of Donbas are pawns; were I Putin I would have escalated to the point of nuclear war and beyond to stop the attacks. But I am not privy to the deals struck with the Chinese and other world powers. Putin is a member of a team, and cannot just lash out.
To those of you who use InvestmentWatchblog dot com as a source of information:
This is the mission statement of one [1] of their eleven [11] trackers [RadiumOne]:
“”RadiumOne builds intelligent software that automates media buying, making big data actionable for marketers and connects them to their next customer. RadiumOne generates first-party data about actual customers — from their behaviors, actions and interests demonstrated across the web and mobile. Then we access…real-time impressions each day across the Web, video, social and mobile to reach consumers in real-time no matter where they are. Our intelligent software and methodologies increase the relevance and personalization of ads through sophisticated algorithms that find valuable characteristics, gauge consumer behaviors, and target ads with laser focus to the right audiences.” – LINK.
Just be careful and aware.
Bakunin:
Andrew, with all due respect, that’s a strawman argument you are pulling. Nobody has ever claimed it needed to be “ethnically cleansed”:
That was the impression I had of the claims being made by those posting this information, especially the citation in the same article of a need for 140,000 wells to be put down (50 per sq. mile!), or one every 750 feet!
In accordance with article 37.2 of the agreement, the local residents have to sell their land and property. In case of refusal they are to be coerced to do it to serve the Shell’s interests. The company’s expenditure is to be compensated by Ukraine at the expense of produced gas
I would point out that this agreement, as near as I can tell is not public information. I have no idea where Strategic Culture.org got this or if there is any way to verify it. From what is described, it sounds like the process of eminent domain, and I think it would be wrong to read more into it.
There is undoubtedly all manner of corrupt interest in the project against the people on the land (the first of which would be that in my mind, the mineral rights and royalties should go to the poor landholders as in the US – instead they will be skimmed by corrupt politicians and oligarchs like Timoshenko and the people will get nothing), but I cannot for the life of me see how it would need the total clearing of human habitation from such a large area. Anyone who has driven through the American midwest can see how many oil and gas wells there are located on various corners of farms.
Thank you so much Saker. Your assessment is wonderfully intelligent and heartfelt. It was such a joy and relief to have my growing sense of the situation confirmed in this way. Thank God you are here!
Novorossiya will be decided by military strategy of the rebels. Kiev can only bomb and bombard with long range artillery. This conflict, if it develops as a war of people versus distant cannons will need to see a mobile attack force that strikes and withdraws, strikes and withdraws. Mobility is necessary, not defensive siege and resistance.
There are many weak points in the “encirclement” of Donbass. In the south, along the sea, their forces can be driven into the sea. In the east, along the border, their forces can be destroyed against the wall of Russia.
The Air Force of Kiev can be destroyed. All it takes is enough MANPADS and bait to draw them overhead. They bomb civilian targets and stay away from militia.
The militia reportedly has between 2000 and 15,000 men. Of those, maybe 1000 have seen a lot of combat. That core can be multiplied into a hundred companies of very effective units. With RPG’s, anti-tank missiles and MANPADS, they can take apart the sedentary Army of Zombies Kiev commands. Each unit of tanks they wipe out means the others draw away, further from the cities, less effective as blockades.
With no cease fire, Kiev actually is burning up its machinery, its cannon, and creates a sense of tension that there is no advance.
General Giap of Vietnam and General Ochoa of Cuba (Angola and Nicaragua) were masters of artillery (Soviet theory, native application). They advanced artillery. Kiev uses it like an amateur, in place, confident it will win because it is out of reach.
That must be exposed and exploited.
Drones are an issue. But Russia must want to develop countermeasures versus drones, so this conflict gives their technical staff a perfect laboratory to test and learn how to spoof drones, take down drones and upset their Intel capabilities.
I suspect a few Russian drones are flying over Ukie installations and supplying Intel to the militia.
Drones in the armaments of Novorossiya would be a great tool. A missile or two shot from drones on advancing armor would send panic all the way to Biden’s bedroom.
How about a drone delivering leaflets over Maidan for psyops impact?
Maybe some young Russians who like playing hacker or inventor can rig some drones for the militia to use.
This war will have an upside if it is the rebels on the attack, using imagination and technology alongside their courage and weapons.
So the junta airforce bombed a mine in Donetsk today and Mr Akhmetov was in Kiev over the past few days pleading for the army not to use artillery on Donetsk or destroy its infrastructure and today Porky shows up in Slovyansk and says he wants to negotiate with the real masters of Donbas. I think I see the picture here. Now what will the militia do? They need to make their move quickly and Mr Strelkov and the other leaders need some body armor.
No one ever said it had to be a fair fight.
Anon 20:03:
It might take 20 years for effective de-Nazification.
So you expect 20 years to suddenly accomplish what 47 years (1944 to 1991) did not in Galicia?
Why?
Canadian says:
Putin can wait on Father Winter who has always interceded on behalf of the Russian peoples and helped them achieve their greatest victories.
On another point.
Germany has identified a member of the German intelligence agency who has been working as a spy for the Americans for the past three years.
The means of communication is reported to be via an encrypted secret application installed on the German spies work machine.
When the spy wished to communicate he called up the app and had it provide him with the current forecast for NY, NY. When he did this he was then able to securely transmit secret German documents from his office desktop.
A very secure communications system. No need to leave the office, no need for dead drops. It must have been a good system since the spy was unobserved and unsuspected for over 3 years.
How then was he caught? News reports indicate that he was found out after he attempted to sell the same secrets to the Russians.
It is entirely possible that German counter-intelligence uncovered this attempted communication with the Russians. But the spy was himself part of the German counter-intelligence apparatus and therefore could be considered likely to have knowledge of how to escape detection by his own agency.
An alternate explanation, which I prefer. The spy sought to make contact with the Russians and offered to sell them German secrets. The Russians then informed the Germans of the approach. Subsequent monitoring of the spies activity revealed the secret mode of communications with US agents.
I think what we see of Russia-Ukraine-EU-US relations is simply the tip of an extremely large iceberg. Russia has economic interests in France and Germany. Whatever action Russia seeks to take in Donbass will not be allowed to impair Russian strategic interests. And Russian interests are best served by giving the EU nations time to realize that their relations with the US are those between a dying hegemon and its serfs.
The core issue here is not the liberation of the Donbass. The core strategic issue is the liberation of the EU. And as best as I can make out, Putin is making all the right moves.
Cheers!
I posted this question a few days ago, but it seems to have gotten buried.
Perhaps some kind person here can help me to understand the general situation in East Ukraine more clearly. These may sound like dumb questions, but the information in the Western media is very slanted.
I understand the Kiev coup has enacted a series of laws to marginalize the citizens of Eastern Ukraine, but the only one I know of now is that Russian was no longer recognized as an official language.
Question: are there other new laws? Any specifics on these would be helpful (links, sources).
Next, I understand that in response to the antagonistic stance of the Kiev regime, a Federal State of Novorossiya was declared in May, composed of self-proclaimed republics of Donetsk and Luhansk. My understanding is that they are seeking recognition as a new state, independent of both Russia and the rump-Ukraine. They are not proposing to join Russia as Crimea did.
Questions: are there any details in English on the aims and government structure of an independent Novorossiya (URL?)?
Has Russia officially recognized Novorossiya?
I know that we are talking about a very fluid situation, but if there are any programmatic statements on Novorossiya, I would be grateful to have a link to them.
— Young Oak
Larchmonter, consider the threat of betrayal and assassination and note my last 2 posts. The junta is threatening Mr Akhmetov that they will destroy ‘his’ infrastructure if he does not bring the militia to heel and make a deal. The militia is likely under threat of decapitation.
The way I see it the militia needs to flex their muscles very very soon and prove they cannot be eliminated while protecting their leadership.
The power of the oligarchs must be dealt with some how if the militia is to succeed without betraying their cause and selling out. I doubt that Donetsk is truly a safe haven – probably more dangerous than Slovyansk in some ways.