This issue is one which divides many sincere and good people and which I rarely see addressed directly. And yet, it is a crucial one. Today, I want to address is head on.
The realistic argument (version one)
As Otto von Bismarck said, “politics is the science of the possible”. It is all well and dandy to hope for the best, but unless you are delusional or believe in magic-thinking, you have to prepare for the worst and settle for anything in the middle. There are plenty of conflicts which end in some kind of compromise which neither side likes, but which both sides accept simply because the alternative is even worse. And as Andreas Walsh correctly points out, a “united federated Nazi-free Ukraine” (to use Bezler’s words) is a very tall order. In fact, there are growing signs that the support for the so-called “anti-terrorist operation” (ATO) is *growing*, that the zombificaton if the Ukrainian people is very successful. For example, just two days ago I was watching yet another videoconference between the some citizens of Kiev and some citizens of Donetsk and I was horrified to see that the folks from Kiev still seriously spoke, apparently with all sincerity, about the “Russian army being involved in the battles in Novorussia”. As for the latest Ukie Rada, it is chock-full of Nazi field commanders, death-squad leaders, clearly Nazi politicians and, of course, oligarchs. The truth is that there are no signs of even a slight de-Nazificaton in the Ukraine, quite to the contrary, all the signs are of a rapid and strong Nazification of the Ukrainian society.
That is all true, but that is only part of the picture. A small part.
The realistic argument (version two)
The big problem with the realistic argument above is that is is completely focused on the short term. Worse, it replies to the wrong question which is this: “are there any signs of de-Nazification in the Ukraine or not?” The correct question is very different, and it is this one:”is a Nazi regime in the Ukraine viable?”. That is also a realistic argument, I would argue more realistic than the first one. To answer this question, we really need to answer to sub-questions:
a) Is a Nazi regime in the Ukraine intrinsically viable? That is, in the best of external circumstances, could a Nazi regime remain in power in the Ukraine? In practical terms this means this: can the Nazis prevent the total “somalization” of what is left of the Ukraine? Could they, if given enough support from abroad, stabilize and somehow rebuilt some form of statehood?
b) Even if a Nazi regime in Kiev is viable, can the countries around the Ukraine accept a Nazi Ukraine as a long-term neighbor? After all, Hitler was never voted out of power, it took the Soviet military (with some late assistance by the Anglo powers) to get rid of him. I would argue that there are some regimes which are inherently so terrible that nobody can ever accept them (ISIS for example).
Now let’s begin by the first question.
I don’t think that anybody will deny that the Ukraine is a sinking ship. The Ukrainian economy is gone, finished, dead. There is no money left, no cash, no gold. Right now, the Ukraine is literally “coasting by inertia on an empty tank” and when it finally comes to a standstill things will get really, really ugly. Right now, the regime in power is busy doing all sorts of very “patriotic” but utterly useless things. They are re-writing history books (even though they lack the money to print them), they are accepting non-citizens in top government positions (Americans, Poles, Germans, Lithuanians, Georgians, etc.) and they are changing the name of WWII. Great stuff, for sure, but it is painfully clear that they Junta has no plan to fix the economy and that it won’t even pretend. So we are dealing with a sinking ship whose crew is not even pretending to make an effort to prevent her from going to the bottom of the ocean. How viable is that?
Now let’s look at the second question:
It is also undeniable that neither Europe nor Russia can simply turn away from the Ukraine like they have from sub-Saharan Africa and pretend that it does not exist. No matter how much the Ukraine will end up resembling Somalia, the Congo or Liberia, the Ukraine does exist, millions of people live there, and they don’t want to die. And they have guns, lots of guns. So no matter what the politics are, the EU and Russia will have to rescue the Ukrainian people and neither side has the means or the will do to so alone. That, in turn, means that both sides have a veto power on any rescue plan for the Ukraine. Including Russia.
Russia, by the way, has the option of rescuing only the Donbass, which is the richest and best educated part of the Ukraine anyway, and leave the rest of it to the EU bureaucrats. Russia is also far more capable of isolating herself from a “africanized” Ukraine then the EU. In other words, the EU is far more threatened by chaos in the Ukraine than Russia, and far less capable of dealing with the consequences of that chaos than Russia. And the Russians understand that.
Last, but most certainly not least, no matter who is in power and no matter what the politics of the situation, geography dictates a simple reality: Russia will always be the Ukraine’s biggest trading partner. To think otherwise simply ignores the nature of market forces. In other words, any, and I mean any, plan for the reconstruction of the Ukraine will have to center on the reestablishment of economic ties with Russia.
All of the above can be very simply summed up like this: in the long run, no regime in Kiev is viable unless it has the support of Russia. It is really that simple.
Of course, in the short term and even mid term, the AngloZionists can prop up a Nazi regime in Kiev, but in the long run this is futile, they simply don’t have anywhere near the resources needed to make that happen.
Pretend wars and real wars
The recent flurry of pretend-wars presented to us by CNN have resulted in a complete misconception by the general public of how real wars are fought. We are used to the US attacking, the “bad guys” shooting something back, then the US wins, and everybody goes on to the next pseudo-war. This is not how real wars happen.
First, real wars take years to resolve. I don’t mean pseudo-wars like Desert Storm or the bombing of Serbia. I mean *real* wars. Like WWI and WWII. Or the US war against Japan in the Pacific. Or the Korean war (which technically is still ongoing).
Second, in most real wars the attacked side is mostly unprepared to defend itself, hence the attack. This is very true of Russia, as some of correctly deduced from the Khazin Q&A: by 2014 Russia was not ready to fight the AngloZionist Empire (Russia would have preferred to have the conflict happen in 2020). But when you get attacked, you don’t get to chose the time of the attack, that advantage is inherently for the attacker.
Third, because of this, most real wars begin by a retreat of the attacked party. That directly flows from the second point above. Right now, Russia has “retreated” to less than the full Donetsk and Lugansk regions and she had to “give up” not only most of historical Novorussia, but the entire Ukraine. This is normal and entirely predictable. It is, in fact, quite amazing that the entire Ukrainian military has not managed to subdue two fairly small regions.
But anybody who seriously believes that this is were this war will end is completely naive and does not understand what is at stake here: the very existence of Russia as a nation and a state. Russia will never ever allow this conflict to just freeze anywhere near the current line of contact. In fact, Russia will never allow a Nazi regime in Kiev to remain in power and, as I have explained above, Russia does have the means to prevent that.
The old folks in the Donbass who immediately compared the current war to WWII are correct. In both cases, these wars were about the very survival of Russia not only as a nation and a state, but even as a civilizational realm. The fact that WWII was fought mainly with the German Wehrmacht while the modern war is fought primarily by advanced propaganda techniques makes absolutely no difference. In both cases we are dealing with an attempt to destroy “Russia” in the largest sense of the word. Having met a lot of people who lived through WWII, including Russians who lived in Germany, and having studied the history of that war, I would argue that today’s level of russophobia is even worse then during Hitler’s times. At least during WWII most Germans were not brainwashed into hating Russians (that kind of crap was only believed by NSDAP Party members, and that not even by all!), whereas nowadays the russophobia has become generalized and completely hysterical, especially in the USA and the Junta-controlled Ukraine.
If you can, read the Ukrainian nationalist press, listen to their speeches, read their websites, including social ones, try to expose yourself to as much real Ukrainian nationalist thought as you can and you will come to realize a simple thing: at its very core, the “Ukraine” is nothing but an “anti-Russia”. The Ukraine as a concept does not have a positive content, in fact, it does not even have any inherent reality. The Ukraine is only anti-Russian, it is defined by its opposition to Russia.
Historically, the Ukrainian project was first created by the Papacy as an “anti-Orthodoxy”, but following both the decline of Christianity in the West and the rise of nationalism the “Ukrainian project” turned from being primarily anti-Orthodox to its modernized, secular, version – being anti-Russian.
Just like Judaism is, in historical, cultural and religious terms, nothing but an anti-Christianity, so is “Ukrainianism” just an “anti-Russism”. You think that I am kidding?
Just look at the freaks in power in Kiev: US-born immigrants, Jewish oligarchs, bona-fide Nazis, Uniat priest, “Gay-rights” activists, death-squad commanders and pro-European students. Tell me, is there any idea, any real value which unites this freaks zoo? Only one: hate, rabid hate for Russia.
Realistic realism
The ontological relationship betwen Russia and the Ukraine is similar to the one of a electron and positron: combined the explode and release a lot of energy (in the form of violence, hopefully without gamma-rays). The good news for Russia is that it’s mass of matter is way bigger than the mass of the Ukrainian anti-matter, by several orders of magnitude. In plain English this simply means that the “Ukrainians positrons” (the real hardcore Russophobic Nazis) will lose, at least in the long run. Russia’s mass is bigger in economic, demographic, geographic, intellectual, cultural, social, spiritual and, of course, economic terms. The Nazis don’t stand a chance.
So Bezler, far from being naive, is simply looking further in the distance. Of course, the immediate task at hand is to protect Novorussia and allow it to survive the Winter. Then the short term task will be to rebuilt Novorussia (which you should think of as “liberated Ukraine” as opposed to “occupied Ukraine” i.e. Banderastan). The mid term task will then be do reach some kind of deal with whoever is in power in Kiev which will provide temporary but good security for Novorussia. Lastly, the long term task will be to apply the correct political pressure to covertly foster a process of de-Nazification of the Ukraine while appearing to be doing almost nothing (let the Ukies think that they are “de-Nazifying themselves”).
Yes, this will take years, just like any war does. But there is no other solution. It is the hight of naiveté to believe Russia can afford to live next to an “anti-Russia”, nevermind the tiny Novorussia. And, finally, the people of the Ukraine, most of them at least, deserve so much better than to live under a Nazi regime! Yes, the Imperial propaganda today appears to be winning, but the first cracks are already appearing, especially in Europe, and the more the freaks in Kiev show their true face, the harder it will be for the Europlutocrats to sell them as the “good guys” to an already impoverished and mostly hostile European population. This will be just as with the “heroic Afghan Mujahideen” who began as “freedom fighters”, but who were then downgraded to “Islamic Fundamentalists”, then to “al-Qaeda terrorists” and now “ISIS Über-villans”.
After all is said and done, and the dust settles, and the war is over, two things will remain: the fact that the Ukraine is an artificial entity and the fact that nobody will want to re-start that war. In theory, breaking the Ukraine up into several parts is possible, but presents huge risks: the issue of borders is potentially the best way to restart violence and terror. A far better solution is to make sure that each region is allowed to maintain and develop its identity. So for all these reasons, a “A united federated Nazi-free Ukraine” is not only a possible solution, it is the only solution.
Bezler is right.
The Saker
Is Bezler really naive?
“A united federated Nazi-free Ukraine?”
Please, that train has left the station.
Total fantasy at this point“
For eight months now Russia has tried to find a fair political solution that would be acceptable to ALL parties but he Kiev hunta and the west totally refuse to cooperate. They want Russia to force Novorossia to commit suicide. Well, that will not happen because it would mean suicide for Russia and Putin too. In the mean time there are sanctions against Russia and the Usa and the west support real nazis in Kiev. They have obviously “forgotten” the past (WW2). It is time to remind them about that, it is time to liberate Novorossia, Transniestria and Malorossia too! The aim of the american sanctions is also “regime-change” in Russia. But Russia will survive without McDonalds, I-phone and Mercedes, even without SWIFT and G8 membership, but not without its dignity, self-asteem, and not without a free Novorossia of eight oblasts!
Everyone seems to accept without question the narrative of a “coup” supported by US operatives ousting Yanukovich’s regime, and thus the Ukrainian crisis began. I have read the transcript of Putin’s response to a programmed question on this topic, in his speech at the Valdai event. Surely major questions and gaps are abundant!
Essentially, the narrative is that after signing a comprehensive supposed settlement agreement, Yanukovich against Putin’s own advice personally left Kyiv and also ordered “withdrawal” of law enforcement. Yanukovich journeyed to Kharkiv where he contacted Putin and claimed that someone was holding him, Yanukovich, at “gunpoint” so he could not go on to Rostov. And then, somehow, the “gunpoint” went away, and Yanukovich resurfeced in Crimea, some 250 miles away and from there on to Russia.
So where is the “coup”? Yanukovich abandoned his post, himself ran away and this folded his own government. He could have stood his ground, chose not to.
Maybe someone “handling him” instructed him to go away. It all became very convenient for Putin & Co to now claim that the legitimate Ukrainian government was overthrown, and thus the Budapest Memorandum about Ukrainian territorial integrity could be scrapped,—hence annexation of Crimea, an operation clearly pre-planned months in advance.
Project Novorussia was first mentioned by Putin.—At that time, Ukraine had a totally open border with Russia, had no operative armed forces to speak of, and some 80% of Ukrainian population had a favorable attitude about Russians. Ukraine was ridiculously disarmed, and peaceable, no credible threat to anyone.
Back then and to this day, NATO leaders do not want Ukraine as a member of NATO,
so the whole commotion about Ukraine joining NATO, making its territory available for NATO bases, facilitating NATO takeover of Crimea, it is all such total nonsense and rubbish! Where is the documentation for any of that?
Maybe there was discussion by
persons like Pyatt and Nuland, about who would be best to fill the power vacuum caused by Yanukovich abandoning post.
But numerous questions remain unanswered like where was Rinat Akhmetov at the time? Where were the shadowy oligarchs?
What were the Russian-based oligarchs up to? Maybe the Novorussia project was an effort by Russian-based oligarchs to dispossess Ukrainian-based oligarchs?
Ultimately a battle for resources, oil, gas, coal, mineral deposits?
So Ukraine is not a viable state. So what? US State Dept and CIA have long experience in operating governments that have no viability by ordinary standards. As long as there are even a handful of willing collaborators CIA will perceive no problems.So Ukraine and Ukrainians suffer – life is suffering. No one in the West cares.
The only points where I can see a problem for the West are emigration and nukes. If life gets hard enough in Ukraine we would expect a tide of migration. But that remains speculative. Americans don’t much anticipate problems, they presume they are all-powerful and can fix it if it happens. Maybe the migration will mostly be towards Russia and it becomes their difficulty. Maybe a lot of Ukrainians die in place. Blame that on the Russians.
The nuke business is scary. Fifteen operational reactors in country and too many in Banderastan. The reactors do not run themselves, they need large numbers of skilled people. They need both material and social infrastructure. The accident at Chernobyl was far from a worst case scenario. The installation at Dnepropetrovsk is by far the largest on the planet. The consequences would travel well beyond Ukraine and Russia. But US planners probably don’t much care. Langley and Wall Street will remain safe, so again, so what?
too old to create a bogger identity
Re
@Anonymous:Hitler did not have against Russia. Hitler had a problem with the Bolsheviks and the community that engineered and carried out the Bolshevik/Zionist Revolution to destroy Russia from within
Saker:
Nonsense. Hitler was an anglophile, financed by Britain and the US, who hated Jews *and* Russians whom he considered as subhumans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Untermensch). Even in the Middle-Ages the Germans has the saying “Slaven sind Sklaven” (Salvs are slaves). Read Rosenberg if you don’t believe me.
I agree with THe Saker. Of course the genesis of Naziism is one of the most contested areas of historical studies—especially since it has become anathema in the academy and elsewhere seriously to question the good/bad picture of WW@ and its run-up.
I have just started reading the work of Guido Preparata, on the forces that pushed Hitler to power in the 30s. Mainly, his book, “Conjuring Hitler: How the Western Elite Incubated Naziism, 1900-1938.”
You can read a fairly detailed essay/review here:
http://guidopreparata.com/chpg/McGregor.pdf
Also, at his site, excerpts from the book and other essays.
Amazon reviews show that the book has persuaded most readers of Conjuring Hitler to take Preparata’s work and his analysis very seriously indeed.
Katherine
30 November, 2014 01:26
Russophobia in Ukraine seems to be a a recent phenomenon. In 2010, a Pew Trust survey found a large majority of Ukrainians believed that they had been better off under the Soviet Union, i.e., under Russian domination, than under the current “free enterprise” regime.
So what has changed? It appears that hatred of Russians in Ukraine, so far as it exists widely, must be the result of deliberate political actions of those under Anglo-Zionist influence, for example the Chatham House, US State Department, NATO tool, Arse Yatsenyuk.
This raises the question, why is the US sponsoring Russophobia in the name fascist nationalism? The answer is perhaps to be found in what is happening throughout the EU. The European peoples have been the target of a benign genocide, involving suppression of the fertility of the indigenous people, combined with mass immigration and legally enforced multi-culturalism.
The elite enforced process of the destruction of the peoples of Europe as racial and cultural entities is deeply resented by the great majority of the people. Only liberal idiots and criminal opportunists support the program.
What has been the result? A massive resurgence of nationalism, throughout Europe, Golden Dawn, the front Nationale, UKIP, etc.
So how does the elite proceed from here? Easy: once the nationalists are in power, convert them to a program of Nazi-style ethnic cleansing, but on a scale only dreamned of by the most rabid Nazis.
And there you are: the Nazis ready for a second round with the totalitarian Russkies. Europe once again to self-destruct. The US of Aggression to pick up the pieces, including this time, the pieces of Russia.
Next stop: China.
Re: Anonymous said…
Not strictly on topic, but this book was a compelling read about WWII and the rise of Hitler.
http://www.amazon.com/Conjuring-Hitler-Guido-Giacomo-Preparata/dp/074532181X
30 November, 2014 09:05
Yes! I hadn’t seen this when I posted my own recommendation of Preparata’s book. It sheds light on the relationship between the USA, the UK, and the rise of Hitler.
I will elaborate a little on the relationship between Judaism and Christianity, in particular Orthodox Christianity.
Yes, Judaism is older than Christianity, and for Orthodox Christians in particular that ancient religion IS Christianity. Saint Stephen was stoned because he dared to say as much, and just as for other Christians there is a huge reliance upon sacred texts of the Bible as supporting elements of the faith.
“Let Habbakuk the God-inspired
Stand with us on the divine watchtower;
Let him point out to us
The brilliant angel who proclaims
‘Today is the day of the world’s salvation
For Christ almighty is risen.’ “
[Easter canon of St. John of Damascus]
What Saker thinks of as Judaism is not these Scriptural texts, and that is where the divergence comes. His statement refers to rabbinical texts from after the time of Christ, (at least, that is my understanding.)
Maintaining a rabidly anti-Russian regime in Ukraine is worth any price to the West, because the real prize is Russia herself.
“Just like Judaism is, in historical, cultural and religious terms, nothing but an anti-Christianity…”
WTF!?
and with that the fools and naive can point and chant “anti-semite” – and could you blame them?
Well yes you could, but still.
That one sentence pollutes any nuance, any thoughtful analysis, any factual argument saker makes.
Shame saker is turning out to be a religious zealot – or at least an anti-jewish one.
This could explain the strange “western sexual dysfunction” theme of late.
I would really like to hear a clarification of that sentence in a hope that I am wrong.
I am an American and I have never believed a single part of the narrative about Ukraine that is universal in the US and EU. That said the narratives here about Nazis and Zionists and the long list of invective and appeals to simplified histories appalls me.
It doesn’t surprise me however because of what I know of the terrible history of Ukraine and the ‘between lands’, the bloodlands of the last century.
That Americas feckless leaders have set in motion war in Ukraine is beyond appalling. Embrace it if you will here but nobody will win.
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/archives/2010/nov/11/worst-madness/
http://www.newrepublic.com/article/books-and-arts/magazine/79084/snyder-bloodlands-hitler-stalin
A factual and analytcal delight!
Unfortunately, there are two aspects that may throw this astute poetry out of the window. The Russian oligarchs and whether Putin can resolve that problem and the Euro-Commission Lords and US neo-conservative dogs of war who seem totally atuned to the needs of the Russian oligarchs.
Extremists – in this case Praviy Sector and Svaboda loonies – are at best useful fools, their effect is always conflict and often death and destruction but their time is limited. On the other hand, the Oligarchs and the pot-pourri of the powerful with their think tanks, their vested interests and their exceptionalist heritage will perdure unless they are disposed of violently and specifically. Their hands are mixed in with every influential geo-political force for at least the last 120 years; neither China, Russia, the US or the Eu can be serisouly analysed without taking into account their hand behind each velvet curtain.
Keep going Saker! You are a source of valuable information that is vital in these times of pain.
This will be just as with the “heroic Afghan Mujahideen” who began as “freedom fighters”, but who were then downgraded to “Islamic Fundamentalists”, then to “al-Qaeda terrorists” and now “ISIS Über-villans”.
They were discardable from the start. It was all propaganda. The University of Nebraska-Omaha authored books that taught Afghani children to hate the soviet. Taught them violence and terror. Taught them how to count using guns and dead Russians. Books filled with violent images. Sounds familiar? They had Allah and Soviet-Hatred, while the Ukrainians have Nationalistic White Pride and Russian-Hatred. Both without a doubt langely creation. Like ISIS, Al-CIAda and whatever other group they pops up.
A few years back, I remember reading that these books are still being published in the USA for Afghanistan. Did they care about the people then? Do they care about them now? Would you expect these people to become normal human beings after such indoctrination? Are the Afghani mujhadeen seen in a different light than the Ukraine NAZIs or even ISIS? They are all tools.
You mention EU a lot but you forgot the main player, the USA. Total violent civil war and chaos is what the USA wants and a very likely outcome. They don’t care if the fascist rule. What’s a few NAZIs compared to Russia? Didn’t the Bankers support them the first time around?
From the 1933 until the 40s, Hitler offered peace initiatives and treaties. But Russia, USA, Britain, France and let us not forget the International Jews wanted war with Germany. They wanted to destroy it. Did Britain come to it sense and accept a peace treat with Germany? Britain and the rest of them wanted to crush Germany at all costs.
More Germans died after the war, than during the war. They were and still are ruled and motivated by the same basic savagery. Nothing has changed, except this time round the target is Russia and for similar reasons. Back then, Germany was no longer playing the game correctly, like Russia isn’t now. EU will play along with the USA/NATO, for the same false logic it bailed out the banks. They are too big too fail.
Robert:
I think this may be the only time I ever have or ever will quote the source of this one, but it seems to say it all:
“We have no partner for peace.”
Other options are precluded from the Saker’s argument because they have been precluded by events.
As for this:
“The term Nazi in the Ukrainian context is not identical to the German use of the term in the Hitler era. But however one defines Nazi, is there any way to make an idea or set of beliefs disappear, be non-existent … be “Nazi-free”?
I’ve said that in other contexts, but in Ukraine the Nazis have their grandfather’s party card laminated and mounted on the wall in the centre of a swastika. There’s nothing “neo” about them. But this supports, and I agree with, your suggestion that suppressing cultural beliefs does not make them go away. Look at the Russian Orthodox Church in Russia.
GRIEVED:
I know Naomi has been speaking far beyond her natal pond, but are you Canadian? NDP?
THEY DO NEED RUSSIAN TROOPS
. . . along side, mixed with locals. Have you watched some of those early videos of AFDNR in action? Enough to drive a time-and-motion specialist crazy. So much wasted motion!
For instance, drop in a mortar shell, run in one direction, cover ears, fire, then change direction and run to the ammo pile for another shell.
I’ve noticed they are moving much better now, but in a recent airport video — the one where they do the satire of Strelkov’s fire station comment — there’s a guy looking very much like a football player doing some fancy broken-field running, hugging what must have been a shell, with the gunner screaming at him THROW IT! THROW IT!
Especially if there’s a winter war, somebody who has done it would have so much to teach! Too bad Norway is behaving badly these days.
Quote:
“Russia is also far more capable of isolating herself from a “africanized” Ukraine than the EU. In other words, the EU is far more threatened by chaos in the Ukraine than Russia, and far less capable of dealing with the consequences of that chaos than Russia. And the Russians understand that.”
End of quote
That is not clear at all to me. Russia is the one having to deal with the influx of displaced people from Ukraine (all parts of Ukraine), the one having to deal with increasing levels of anger among the population as a consequence of the slow-motion but blatant and continuous genocide of Donbass people at the hands of Kiev. Europe is closed to Ukrainians, and its population is thoroughly brainwashed.
Quote:
“Last, but most certainly not least, no matter who is in power and no matter what the politics of the situation, geography dictates a simple reality: Russia will always be the Ukraine’s biggest trading partner. To think otherwise simply ignores the nature of market forces. In other words, any, and I mean any, plan for the reconstruction of the Ukraine will have to center on the reestablishment of economic ties with Russia.”
End of quote
To begin with, this is in total contradiction with the previous quoted statement where Russia is said to have a unique capacity to isolate itself from a messy Ukraine. It is hard to see how it will both have that capacity for isolation while remaining its biggest trading partner by necessity.
In any case, I don’t think that the “reconstruction of Ukraine” is something that the West is particularly worried about. The West does not give a damn if they destroy Ukraine’s economy completely. In fact, it looks very mucha as if this may well be the main goal: to create conditions that force the emigration of as many Ukrainians as possible (as happened in the Baltics and in Greece for example) so that the countries resources can be more easily appropriated by the Western money-changers.
I also take issue with the notion of de-nazification as a kind of spontaneous process that will eventually arise out of discontent. I can hardly see how. Those who can will leave. Those who can’t, will be either assimilated by the fascist thugs or terrified by them. It is already a fact that the population of Kiev and Western Ukraine has been so thoroughly indoctrinated as to cheer for genocide. They are truly convinced the entire Donbass deserves continuous shelling and destruction.
The western press keeps working overtime to enhance Russophobia.
Nobel prize writer Mario Vargas Llosa, an influential man in the liberal ranks of the Spanish speaking world, has an absolutely revolting opinion piece in Spain’s largest newspaper. His whorelet style is in the same vein as Bernard Henri Levy. But please look at the illustration that El Pais chose for that article.
http://elpais.com/elpais/2014/11/28/opinion/1417171876_618448.html
Clearly, there is a huge and relentless disinformation campaign against Russia. Ukraine is a huge country for European standards, and a very resource-rich country. I repeat, the US and European elites are interested in squeezing what they can out of it — and there is alot that can be squeezed. They don’t give a tinker’s nickle about the fate of Ukrainian people. They are happy with the destruction program. The are content to see Russiua send aid convoys and deal with the refugee problems.
Nazis will grow. And grow. And grow.
@ anon, dec 1, 2:43
´From the 1933 until the 40s, Hitler offered peace initiatives and treaties.´
And GW Bush was spreading democracy…..He said that by attacking Iraq, the world would be more peaceful….
Be real, if you look at his speeches, there is nothing else than hate and evil. I am not a believer, but know only 2 people with this kind of demonic emanation: Hitler and Ayn Rand. Even Cheney is only a demon boy compared to them.
Anonymous
30 November, 2014 21:30
Well, the very state of Svyatoslav Igorevich the Conqueror was called Rus, not Ukraine! The very name of Ukraine (meaning “the border-land”, the border-land of RUSSIA) proves that historically speaking, there is no such thing as Ukrainians or Ukraine!
Kiev is known as “the mother of all Russian cities”.
Not “the mother of all Ukrainian cities”! Modern so-called “Ukrainians” have absolutely no right to use the phrase of Svyatoslav Igorevich in their war against Russian people. Svyatoslav was a Russian ruler from Kiev who used this phrase when he destroyed the non-Slavic Turkic-Jewish Khazar empire, and it is precisely the modern “Ukrainians” who are ruled by Jewish oligarchs and who wage a war against the Slavic Russian population in south-eastern Ukraine.
It is Ukraine who gets support from all greatest anti-Slavic groups known througout history (Vatican, Germans, Anglos,Zionists, Western world in general), while Russia , as the only Slavic independent power in the the world today is fighting against this coalition.
And do not think that on the Russian side of the conflict people do not use the names of ancient Slavic gods or rulers, they do! I found people calling themselves Perun or Veles on both sides of the conflict.
It is however the Ukrainian side of the conflict who betrays general Slavic interest in this conflict. You need no greater proof then WW2 to understand that if there is no Russia – there is no Slavic people at all !!! Germans treated Poles as subhumans too. And there will be no Slavic people left in Europe if Russia looses the war against Anglo-Zionist-German-Catholic coalition.
Regards from Serbia,
The Wend.
This writer explains what has been in play for decades.
http://www.counterpunch.org/2014/12/01/defending-dollar-imperialism/
Smart people have been gradually placing the jigsaw pieces in place.
Without the petro-dollar,America cannot service it’s debt and the only way they know how to act,is to bludgeon vassals into submission.
Karl Rove explained the US state department mind set….”we are an Empire now!…we act! and while you are analysing events,we will act again!”.
To all those who feel that Russia is vulnerable!…..I am looking for a link will should alay some fears.
cheers.
re:
Supposed Russian vulnerabilities. 2 parts.
Part 1
This is an extract from a far longer article.
@
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/World/WOR-01-011214.html
” Wanna play war, boy?
Now for the “threat” of nuclear war in Europe – bogus or otherwise. It’s pointless to compare the strategic nuclear capabilities of the US and Russia based on numbers, but not on quality.
Take the compounded GDP of US, Germany, France and the UK and compare it to Russia; it’s a victory by landslide. Then examine the strategic nuclear scenario, and it’s a totally different story. GDP alone does not “win” anything.
Washington/Wall Street elites are now deep into nuclear war paranoia. A Council on Foreign Relations study basically “found out” what Pravda had already reported. Other pieces such as this at least hint at the obvious – glaring US strategic shortcomings.
Consider some of the basics:
Russian ICBMs armed with MIRVs travel at about 18 Mach; that is way faster than anything in the US arsenal. And basically they are unbeatable.
The S-400 and S-500 double trouble. Moscow has agreed to sell the S-400 surface-to-air missile system to China. The bottom line is this will make Beijing impermeable to US air power, ICBMs and cruise missiles. Russia, for its part, is already focusing on the state-of-the-art S-500 – which essentially makes the Patriot anti-missile system look like a V-2 from World War II.
The Russian Iskander missile travels at Mach 7 – with a range of 400 kilometers, carrying a 700 kilogram warhead of several varieties, and with a circular error probability of around five meters. Translation: an ultimate lethal weapon against airfields or logistic infrastructure. The Iskander can reach targets deep inside Europe.
And then there’s the Sukhoi T-50 PAK FA. Talk about a real near-future game-changer.
NATO clowns dreaming of a war on Russia would have to come up with an ironclad system to knock out the Iskanders. They don’t have any. Additionally, they would have to face the S-400s, which the Russians can deploy all over the spectrum.
Think of a hefty batch of S-400s positioned at the enclave of Kaliningrad; that would turn NATO air operations deep inside Europe into an absolutely horrendous nightmare. On top of it, good ol’ NATO fighter jets cost a fortune. Imagine the effect of hundreds of destroyed fighter jets on a European Union already financially devastated and austerity-plagued to death.
As if this was not enough, no one knows the exact extent of NATO’s strategic capabilities. Brussels is not talking. Extra-officially, these capabilities are not exactly a marvel. And Russian intelligence knows it.
——part 2
“Still assuming those NATO clowns would insist on playing war, Moscow has already made it very clear Russia would use their awesome arsenal of 5,000-plus tactical nuclear weapons – and whatever else it takes – to defend the nation against a NATO conventional attack. Moreover, a few thousand S-400 and S-500 systems are enough to block a US nuclear attack.
None of this hair-raising Apocalypse Now scenario is even taking into account the Russia-China alliance – the major, game-changing Eurasian story of the 2010s.
Just in case the “pivoting to Asia” gang starts harboring funny ideas about the Middle Kingdom as well, China is massively investing in bouncing lasers off satellites; satellite-hitting missiles; silent submarines that surface beside US aircraft carriers without prior detection; and a made-in-China anti-missile missile that can hit a reentering satellite moving faster than any ICBM.
In a nutshell, Beijing knows the US surface fleet is obsolete – and undefendable. And needless to add, all of these Chinese modernizing developments are proceeding way faster than anything in the US.”
From my own studies,I find these evaluations to be correct.
The US evolved to a sea based Empire,projecting power through sea and air bases,spending vast sums of FRN’s(federal reserve notes..aka the dollar).
The British Empire mark 2.
Certainly their carrier battle groups look impressive,but only to
those who are militarily weak.
cheers.
Anon 30 November, 2014 22:05
“Maybe someone “handling him” instructed him to go away. “
Yanukovich says he left Kiev because SBU told him to. His safety could not be guaranteed, he said. He could well have been the victim of a coup.
“Back then and to this day, NATO leaders do not want Ukraine as a member of NATO,
so the whole commotion about Ukraine joining NATO, making its territory available for NATO bases, facilitating NATO takeover of Crimea, it is all such total nonsense and rubbish! Where is the documentation for any of that?”
Russia abandoned a base in Vietnam and the US took over almost at once. Crimea is a very strategic base and the US surely had its eyes on it. Like Ukraine, Vietnam is not a NATO member. As for documentation, you will have to ask FSB in Moscow. Russia never would have taken Crimea unless it was vitally important.
Part one:
About Hitler, the US. the UK and Russia. Hitler made no secret of wishing an alliance with the UK. Study what he said and wrote before he came to power. He went out of his way to make his intentions clear in London, where the Nazis were in contact with the British aristocracy and the Royal House. The British Crownprince came to Berlin and made an attempt at a Prussian salute and Rudolf Hess went on an unofficial peace mission to London to stop the war.
Hitler was caught in the past and saw France as the age old enemy and as for the USSR, he only wanted the fertile land, not the people. He said Germany needed to expand and should do so only in the East, as he wanted a land Empire, not colonies overseas. As for the USA, he had no respect for the country and I don’t think the Kaiser had either. Hitler only judged the USA by the performance of its soldiers in WW1, a war he took part in. During WW2, young Hitlerjugend boys, 14 years old, and old men from the village had no trouble catching unmotivated US soldiers. Except for Pattons men, of course, but Patton was one of a kind. US soldiers did not understand what they were doing far from home in Europe, but nonetheless he badly underestimated the USA, which only needed to use ten percent of its military capacity to defeat Japan. Ninety percent was used in Europe, much of it in other European countries and the economic strength of the USA was beyond Hitlers understanding.
In Hitlers or perhaps Goebbels parlance, the Slavs were Untermenschen [subhumans]. Many Germans have Slavic roots since the time of Charles the Great, some Poles fought for Germany and Slovenia was accepted as an Aryan country, not a colony, into the Third Reich, so perhaps the term was used as mere propaganda against the USSR. Or perhaps the Germans were in denial of their Slavic roots in search of a unique identity. Look at Banderastan. Anyway, it can’t be denied German soldiers, full of this propaganda, were so cruel in Ukraine [with the help of local friends] that people who had welcomed the Germans as liberators turned against them. The Germans were no better on the Balkans, where the Serbs suffered terribly.
Part two:
He hated communism. To understand why the UK and France allowed him to come to power, you need to know Germany almost became a communist country after WW1. There were serious revolutionary attempts in more places than one. It was a close call and streetfights were commonplace for years. Hitlers party started with only seven members and grew mysteriously to become an alternative to the communists. How was it done? The party paid thousands of SA-men to patrol the streets! Banderastan again?
The German oligarchs were happy to see the communists in camps and thought they had full control of Hitler, whose party had only *two* seats in the government at first. Did the UK and France agree? Hitler and the minister of the interior were Nazis, nobody else. He got full control eventually, but I don’t know how. During the war, government ministers had to beg and plead to at least see the chairs they were supposed to occupy, but never did.
Hitlers attack on the USSR gave Germany a twofront war he had said he would never allow again. What made him do it? He went against his own firm conviction. Was he insane, was he tricked into attacking or did he take orders?
SEAMUS: ‘The failed patriotic war to save the fatherland’
Thanks, I needed that.
ANONYMOUS #46:
There was no provision in Ukrainian law that a president’s going to Russia terminated his presidency.
The coup came when the Right Sektor set up a gantlet in the approaches to the Rada and beat up any Party of Regions members of parliament who tried to attend.
Yanukovich was then impeached by a show of hands.
Need I say this is not the procedure prescribed by the Constitution?
Nobody confirmed the presence of a quorum, either.
Speaking of which, there wasn’t a quorum when Crimea was donated to Ukraine. Maybe she never did belong to Ukraine.
OK, so here we’re having one of these little Western ‘tics’ on display for a change; to wit, “I-have-Hitler-on-my-mind”.
I’ve come to the conclusion long since that if there ever were to be an open contest for the most perceptive title for a Hitler biography, my entry would be “Hitler — just another braindead Westerner”. He fits the template perfectly; a grip on reality not being a requirement but a total affront to his entire ideology, just as is the case with neoliberalism, neoconservatism, scientology, and what-have-you.
On a more serious note, it could to some extent well be argued that the US has drawn inspiration from Nazi Germany. But still, that is to miss the point as I see it. Despite much clamour to the contrary from what passes for the Western “intelligentsia”, the German Nazis drew their inspiration not from Stalin’s USSR — the latter’s multi-ethnical, egalitarian character (duly codified in its Constitution) was found totally vile by each and every little White supremacist — but from the US Settler Reich and the Brutish Empire, both of them thriving on land-grabbing, lawlessness, enslavement, war, and racist genocide backed up to the hilt by a hideously ugly, braindead, flag-waving home constituency of utter lowlives. Most notably, given Weimar Germany’s social chaos and tensions bordering on civil war, the Nazis were particularly envious of the social cohesion of the US, based on White supremacy, “Manifest Destiny”, and ultra-militarism. And US imperialism gloating in its own crimes in films, books, and newspapers distributed globally was a very real phenomenon by the time Fascism reared its ugly head in Europe.
In short, Nazi Germany sought to emulate successful Anglo-American imperialism but proved unequal to the task since the Slavic peoples would not have it. Absent the lessons of crushing defeat at the hands of a powerful, invading army, Anglo-American imperialism remains stuck in the delusions which Nazi Germany and its little figurehead were to take straight to their hearts.
Reply to Wend, 12-1-2014 at 1643 hours:
My understanding is that the term Ukraine
[“Ukraiina”] was used as early as 1100’s still well within the times of pre-Muscovite “Rus”. Back then it was a region, not a realm or country, just like Italy/Italia was used in the days of the Roman Empire as a region. Sometimes Ukraiina has a variant “Vkraiina” and it probably means “distinct country” from the term “kraiina” or “krai” which do mean “country” in general, related to the verb “vkraiaty” to cut, to make a border. The term for borderland would be “okraiina” related to the verb “obkraiaty” meaning to cut around something, upon its border.
“Rus” is the old name, so modern Ukrainians used to call themselves “Rusychi” or “Rusytsy” as in the original language in the 1100’s epic “Word of Ihor’s [or Igor’s] Campaign”
I have read the original language but do not know if the letters were pronounced the Ukrainian or modern Russian way.
Suffice to say, as a Ukrainian-speaker
I found I could understand well like 80% or more of this centuries’ old language. Its resemblance to modern Ukrainian really astounded me. Anyway, the people known as modern Italians used to call themselves “Romans”. Do modern Italians have the foremost claim to the heritage of the Roman Empire?
I would think so. More than the ethnic Greeks of Byzantium as “Eastern Rome” or the Germans who constructed the Holy Roman Empire.
To a large extent, the problem in uniting Ukraine and Russia is like uniting South Korea and North Korea. Normally, they have different political mentalities and governing systems, though the present government in Ukraine is a deformed wartime government. Ukrainian separatism from Russia comes largely from dread of a resurgence of stalinism, or of some “neo-oprychchyna”, restoration of the mass executions, secret police, GULAG death camps, sacrifice of millions of people, etc. As yet no Ukrainian government has had such a track record, despite all the wild claims that the Ukrainian government intends to exterminate the “Novorussians”.
Where is the documentation that the GOVERNMENT has such a policy [regardless of what some idiot out there might screech here and there]. There is no doubt a lot of anger now in Ukraine, that demilitarizing, open borders, giving up nuclear arsenal, and simply trying to be a “good international world citizen” did not work, and there is a sense of back-stabbing and betrayal. The record now stands that I. Strelkov himself admitted that he fomented the serious warfare in eastern Ukraine, and it was not really the “West” or CIA or Germany. What is an “artifical country” anyways? Take modern Germany, it was a creation of the Prussian kingdom, in the 19th century. Does that make modern Germany “artificial”? If not, why not? Most countries are the result of various military conquests or armed force exercised by some successful power center against others. Modern Russia is a prime example, starting from the originally tiny principality of Moscow around 1270, so if a country or realm is created by military conquests, does that make it legitimate and “natural”? If Russia wants to be a champion of the Slavonic nations, military actions against Ukraine that originally did not even have an operative army and had an open border, that is not a heroic deed [“ne bahatyrske dilo”]. There may exist demented and bloodthirsty quasi-religious cults like those standing behind “racist fascism” and “racist nazism”, but Ukraine is NOT their source. Why not target them directly?
Action to undermine an independent sovereign Ukraine so that Russia be the only “independent” Slavic state, that is really barking up the wrong tree as Americans would like to say.
I agree with the first commenter on 30 November, 2014 01:17 and anonymous Frenchman at 01:46.
This blog post is very far from »analysis and commentary«. Highly questionable items include:
* Judaism is, in historical, cultural and religious terms, nothing but an anti-Christianity
* “africanized” Ukraine, and Russia far more capable of isolating herself from it than the EU
* Nazi, Nazi, Nazi!
And then in a comment, you’re pulling another Rosenberg:
»Hitler was an anglophile, financed by Britain and the US, who hated Jews *and* Russians whom he considered as subhumans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Untermensch). Even in the Middle-Ages the Germans has the saying “Slaven sind Sklaven” (Salvs are slaves). Read Rosenberg if you don’t believe me.«
Rosenberg (»Der Mythus des 20. Jahrhunderts«) is meaningless drivel, high-faluting baratin, nonsense on stilts. Hitler, politely, called it »hard to read«. Goebbels called it an »intellectual burp«. Which is what it is. It has no significance other than being a strawman for propagandists. Just like Streicher, by the way, who was under house arrest during the Third Reich, and only escaped more severe punishment because he had personally protected Hitler’s life on November 9th, 1923 from the police bullets, by marching in front of Hitler (cf. Streicher’s testimonial at the Nuremberg show trials).
»Slawen sind Sklaven.« This is rubbish. So-called »Slavs« are an invention of the 19th century. There was no such »saying« among medieval »Germans«, which didn’t even exist as a country. Some clerics and chronicists wrote in Latin about »sclavi«, which referred to Germanic tribes or even smaller groupings that had not yet been Christianized, also called »Wenden«. So they were pagans, not some other supposedly »Slav« people. »Slavic« is a linguistic fact, not an ethnic one.
Looks to me like your words fly higher than your education on German matters.
Dear Wend,
“
It is however the Ukrainian side of the conflict who betrays general Slavic interest in this conflict. You need no greater proof then WW2 to understand that if there is no Russia – there is no Slavic people at all !!! Germans treated Poles as subhumans too. And there will be no Slavic people left in Europe if Russia looses the war against Anglo-Zionist-German-Catholic coalition.
Regards from Serbia,
The Wend.
Wend, the whole world will be in the graveyard of civilization if Russia loses…but she won’t lose. Even the Gods are really on her side.
anon
“
Hitlers attack on the USSR gave Germany a twofront war he had said he would never allow again. What made him do it? He went against his own firm conviction. Was he insane, was he tricked into attacking or did he take orders?
01 December, 2014 18:36
Anon ! Read Conjuring Hitler” by GGPreparatoa..following the money Hitler was taking orders.
So, are we all going to pretend the dog turd isn’t in the middle of the living room carpet?
Is the fact that it was posted by a jerk a good enough excuse?
Ralph calls it “disinformation” which is apt, but the point is it was said by Strelkov, and suggests he is unravelling rapidly.
He’s eased out of the FSB with bad references after he flunks a psychiatric evaluation. He drops dark hints in an online chat room that he was a Maidan sniper. He falsely promotes himself as a military man in the Donbass. He makes a silly and rude attack on Givi — no political instincts at all? He accuses Borodai, with whom he goes back around 20 years and with whom he organized the whole Donbass expedition, of going over to Surkov.
And now he claims the war is due entirely to himself, and if he had not been there all the combatants would have gone home to drink and watch soccer on the couch. (This should improve his ratings with the field commanders he is insulting.)
Moreover, he is running his mouth at Zavtra, where they kiss his feet, without a thought for what will be made of what he says when it gets picked up by news outlets that aren’t his second home. I’ll bet it’ll make it into the history books: war was started by FSB agent who confessed after recall to Moscow.
When I was a kid, I thought I was English — a function of colonialism — although I’m only a quarter. My heroes were Robin Hood and Arthur, and an iconic figure in my reading was the dissolute younger son of the aristocracy who was purchased an army commission by his father which he proceeded to bungle, as in the Charge of the Light Brigade or the whole Crimean War. Imagining Igor Strelkov in a command role brought those images back to me.
His painstaking reconstruction of his campaign in Zavtra demonstrates that this was apt. When asked how he, with no military education, training or experience could command an army, he says his job was the grand strategy. (?? His grand strategy was to prevent any hostilities breaking out until the Russians arrived.) He would rhyme off a wish list, and it was up to his field commanders to figure out a way of fulfilling it.
He bemoans the lack of someone qualified to be his Chief of Staff, whose job he sees as translating the dreams of the commander into intellible orders to his officers. I remember Givi drawing comparisons with someone not specifically named saying Kononov and Zakharchenko “give clear orders which make sense.”
So maybe it was the unification of forces that was Strelkov’s contribution? From Borodai’s description of his job as P.M., it was Borodai who did that. He describes the disparate and mutually hostile groups in control of HQ when he took over: even the fourth floor was at war with the fifth floor.
Borodai even carried “crisis management” into the field. When Khodakovsky and Vostok got pinned in the airport, it was Borodai who took Abwehr to the scene as reinforcements, and when that wasn’t enough, called in Zakharchenko to pull off the rescue.
Strelkov’s one succes fou is the Secret Forum, where invited bloggers can get hard information, which we all crave, provided mainly by a Crimean newspaper editor Boris Rozhin, Colonel Cassad. The flattered members assimilate and disseminate one theory of who’s who and what’s happening and are paid for with facts. To the consumers, it looks like they’re getting something from many independent sources.